It's over now. Best case scenario had me in bed at midnight. This is why I'd consider average case scenario.

SI

CNN asked Harris if Biden was going to go through with the other 2 and she said he wouldn't turn down an opportunity to speak to the American people.

We knew what this was going to be like before this, but now Biden knows what it is going to be like, so he can better prepare. Just sit back and let Trump do damage to himself.

Agreed. I have never appreciated the expansion of the baseball playoffs more than I did last night. Full credit to those here who watched and provided a simple summary.

I think it's a two-pronged strategy - get people disgusted with politics and not show up to vote, and a bet that by "firing up his base," it's going to bring out a bunch of closeted Trump supporters who didn't vote last time. Proud Boy buddies they can get out to vote, or those who can be persuaded that putting Trump aside (because if you're even considering a Trump vote, you've already done that), liberals running the country would end the world. Kind of a counter to getting out the young vote or elderly minority voters on the other side.

40-42% is already too many people who are OK with Trump, so I hope his bet is wrong.

I believe it's the later. The one syllable thing is the hide that it's "anti" something. May make people ask, oh what are they anti? Fascism? Oh..

Sweet! Nice to hear it didn't end up being an all nighter.

Right on. I heard Chris Wallace say it the other way and it took me a second to figure out what he said. Which then made me wonder if I had been saying it wrong the whole time haha!

I'm not sure today's Trump message saying Biden isn't socialist enough is going to work, and there goes all of that work casting Biden as left of Castro.

Right. Did he think the whole "You just lost the far left" was going to be helpful to him? As if the far left didn't know these things about Biden. Almost like they had a primary about this stuff :D.

It was like he thought he had a zinger of line prepared and was desperate to get it out. It ended up just being typical trump. He spent half the debate trying to frame Biden as too far left and since it didn't work he's going to pivot and say he's not left enough. As if progressives are going to listen to a damn thing Trump says. They may stay home, but it's not because Trump is pointing anything out about him.

I'll admit I couldn't even make it through Trump's first speech before deciding to turn off the stream.

I salute any and all point of common ground, but I don't think the Constitution is to blame here. There are reasons why Trump didn't happen 20 or 40 or 60 years ago etc. under the same Constitution. A grossly dysfunctional society esp. as it relates to politics is more the issue IMO. Change the Constitution to whatever you want, but that problem won't go away by top-down solutions.

On a completely unrelated note, I always pronounce biopic as bi-AH-pic. That's the way it should sound in my mind, even though bio-pic obviously explains what the word means.

The problem was a concerted effort by one side of the political aisle to foster distrust in the American political system in order to achieve short term power. While they have achieved the power they desire it has come at a fantastical cost for everyone.

A poll I saw linked by 538 showed 56% do not trust our elections right now. Putin managed to accomplish his goal far faster than he probably imagined was ever possible.

We have two entrances to our subdivision, and the one that is closer to our house goes through an adjoining neighborhood. The guy on the corner of that neighborhood and the main road coming in has a gigantic American flag in his yard and a couple of weeks ago added an equally gigantic Trump 2020 flag with the slogan NO MORE BULLSHIT. I don't know the guy at all, but I pretty much knew all I needed to know just from that.

One of our doctors lives down the street from him and told my wife at a visit a couple of days ago that he can't stand the guy. Doctor took his dog and kids on a walk and apparently it peed in the guy's yard on the way past. When he came back around, the guy came out with his phone, showed him video of the dog peeing, and threatened to call the cops if it happened again. I mean... who does that? If your dog poops in my yard and you don't pick it up, I will (and have) said something. But peeing? Who can control that? Unless your next door neighbor allows his dog to use your yard as a toilet, that's just psycho behavior. That's just looking for a grievance to be pissed (pun intended) about.

Dude is the perfect example of a typical Trump supporter. He's not putting up with what he feels are microaggressions and goes out of his way to be a macho a-hole, but he'll be the first guy to call anyone else a snowflake.

The fact that it was even worse (69%) in 2016 would seem to cast doubt on this conclusion.

I think it really comes down to how the question is phrased. NBC poll in October 2016 showed 74% had some or a lot of confidence all votes would be counted. Those numbers were steady going back to at least '04.

Ok. I'm talking about the Gallup poll in which the question was phrased the way you initially referenced - confidence in the honesty of elections - and found 59% this year, 69% last cycle. So ... ??

I absolutely agree with you. The Constitution just happened to be at the top of my thoughts and thinking some changes could be made to it to help minimize any future trumps. Oh yes most definitely, it is far from a one fix (or options) solution at many different levels.

I'm not sure it's about a failing society as much as it is about ideological sorting within the parties and data analysis methods that makes base mobilization the best strategy for most races.

Trump just claimed he has no idea who the Proud Boys are... suuuure...

He could always ask his pardonee Roger Stone.

OK. Fine.

"Now that you know, Sir, do you unequivocally reject them?"

(Leaving aside that even if he weren't lying, it's criminally irresponsible for the President to not know the name of one of the largest terroristic threats to the United States.)

He told them to 'stand down' again, which sure doesn't sound like a rejection, even given many, many hours to actually write a thoughtful response.

I'm certainly not the first (or the millionth) person to say it, but it is ridiculous & absurd that he can immediately & brazenly lie about practically everything else under the sun, but just can not force himself to denounce white supremacy, regardless of how much time/space/rope he is given.

I have no idea why the guy that wouldn't rent to black people or doesn't want black people counting his money would not denounce white supremacy.

It's not like Woody Guthrie wrote a fucking song about how racist his family is.

The man has zero beliefs. He is a hole of narcissism. He wants nothing other than adoration. Nothing guides him. Nothing moves him.

EXCEPT racism.

He's somehow managed to be the only thing more abhorrent than a pure narcissist. He will make a small exception for racism.

Why again did the GOP decide that he was a better person that Rubio, Cruz, Bush, and Kasich?

I’m sure he knows his own name ;)

Oh wow, I did not know that. I guess you do learn something new every day.

The weird thing is if we had ranked choice voting he doesn't win the nomination and I'm not sure he even tries to get far in the primary. Yet somehow, he's become the beacon of the GOP and everyone acts like they've backed him since day one.

It's surreal to look at where we started with Trump and where we are now despite him not changing in the slightest.

Totally agree. It's a trumpcentrism universe in his head. Everything revolves around him and is clearly a product of never having to be held accountable for his actions. Why would he change if he's never paid for his transgressions? He's awfully quick to disparage so many other people and entities, yet, each and every time when it comes to racism, there's that pause, that small moment in time where you say to yourself, 'Ok he won't do it this time'...and then, NOPE! He did it again. Not only that, he's so narcissistic, that all he had to do was, sit on his fat ass the entire time of his first 4 years and said and done nothing and he would be cruising to re-election right now. He couldn't even do that. He couldn't literally do the thing that would have take the least amount of effort to do because of his narcissism.

Not only did the GOP decide he was better than them, they really changed their tune at how bad and horrible he was to verbally fellating him for the last almost 4 years. But, that's what you get when it's party over country. Kasich would have at least been respectable and kept the 'decorum' of the office of president.

A link for anyone interested:

Old Man Trump - Wikipedia

A friend brought up the fact that Russia/Putin gets the exact same kid-glove treatment from Trump. Only the best values.

Good point. And has warm fuzzies for duterte and erdogan. In addition to his off and on again BFF from north korea.

Trump says he gets along with 'tougher and meaner' leaders: Woodward - Business Insider

Sounds like par for the course for him.

That's because he can't bully them, so he becomes the submissive dweeb trying to get validation from the "cool kids"

1. There are fewer checks on their power.
2. He would like that for himself.
3. He can attempt to gain things for himself by dealing with them directly.
4. Any corruption is hidden, because of the nature of a single source of power.
5. trump is as corrupt as hell.
6. It shows in his handling of his business and all out, desperate attempts to keep it all hidden.
7. Numerous people have pointed out the efforts he's gone to in order to avoid checks on his personal decisions.
8. None of that is possible in a world where leaders are held to public expectation.
9. Of course he gets along with them.

ding ding ding

Talked to my sister in law today who lives in England about the debates. She is interesting to talk to because she can give a perspective about how people from other countries view us. Her husband is south African and they travel a lot so she has great insight.

She told me a black man delivered something to her house the other day and she got into an argument with him. She asked him to put it in the garage as it weighed 450KG and she couldn't move it herself. He refused and she likely got bitchy with him, to be fair she can get that way. The man then said he knows the real reason she is acting like that towards him is he knows all Americans hate black people. She went inside and cried. Said it was the first time after living abroad for 10 years that she was judged for her accent. This is what Trump is doing to us as a nation.

The heck did she get, a grand piano?

lol, no idea. We were so wrapped up in Trump, debate, etc...I didn't even think to ask.

Lifetime supply of Spotted Dick maybe?

How much does 450kg weigh

992 pounds

Can you convert that into dollars?

$1283.18

Could be a pallet of horse meat, conceivably.

Mystery solved. It was a home gym.

Every single week since March the new unemployment claims number has been higher than the worst week of the great recession. I'm really worried what will happen if nothing passes soon and McConnell decides to torch the country for partisan gain.