And maybe create a special police force that goes into schools, businesses, and homes and asks people for their papers.

I’m trying to think of where we have seen that before.

It's the Shirley Principle.

"Surely, they are just going to go after the bad people."
"Surely, they won't use this new power to harass or intimidate"
"Surely they will give people the chance to correct an honest paperwork mistake"

No one trusts the government more than conservatives in 2024.

I don’t think it’s as much they trust the government as the government is going after the people they hate. Let’s be honest, do you really think white conservatives actually care if the brown people who don’t speak English are citizens or not?

Well, they'll save some money by combining it with stopping women of childbearing age to check for pregnancy or birth control since that's usually on the next line of bills to pass.

If you are truly against fixing the mass illegal entries issue based on this, you aren’t grounded in any sense of reality. You can’t deport an American to a foreign country. The foreign country has to accept them and unless you are suggesting that other countries are not aware that they need to check for citizenship proof before accepting these “imaginary American deportees”, you must know this isn’t a sensical concern.

So what you’re saying is you are totally ok with people unconstitutionally being asked for papers, illegally detained, then possibly being deported to a country they are not from who’s job it will then be to figure it out?

How white of you.

Fish in a barrel. I'll be back in two days when the next absurdity pops up.

BREAKING: Trump announces that as president, he will immediately implement a temporary 10% cap on credit card interest rates

"We can't let them make it 25% and 30%."

Credit card interest rates are at a historic high under the Kamala-Biden regime. His simple plan will alleviate… pic.twitter.com/yENoVsqv1S

— George (@BehizyTweets) September 19, 2024

Personally, I wouldn't call it "reality" but I'd call it different priority. On a scale of 1-10, I suspect you and I are in the 8-10 range and many here are on the 0-2 range (e.g. illegal immigrants are not a problem).

You can tighten border security without mass deportations.

So you really think this is going to move slowly enough that people will be verified both here and in the country of origin? How does that square with Trump's claim that mass deportations and camps will start on day one?

How will both the US and the second country check for citizenship? There isn't a list somewhere that can be quickly checked. It requires documentation. What happens when there isn't any documentation? How do we know where to deport to? What happens if the second country says no as will certainly happen in some places like Venezuela?

What's probable cause for checking citizenship? Will it take a second violation or will they demand proof on sight? What happens to people who can't prove citizenship but claim they are? Will there be hearings? What happens to people waiting for hearings?

Is all of this planned for and they are just keeping it a secret or are they just going to start rounding up and hope for the best?

It's funny that you say I'm not serious when all you have is trust me it will all work out okay.

Uncle Ronnie didn't believe in deportation.

At the risk of speaking for others, I think most realize immigration is an issue.

The problem is the so called solutions from the GOP just aren't realistic and pander to low information and low IQ voters who lack the ability to critically think.

A wall wouldn't solve anything and mass deportations on the scale Trump is proposing just isn't feasible without massive costs and violating the rights of Americans. Unless you are in the "have to break a few eggs to make an omelet camp" when it comes to other peoples liberties you can't see this as a realistic solution.

Dutch dodged the question, maybe you'll answer. Logistically what does Trumps proposed mass deportations look like?

Conservatives won't care as long as they send all the cat eating Haitians to Venezuela and not Haitia

I should also add, what happens to the people here on amnesty claims? They aren't citizens but are here legally.

And for that matter, what about people traveling? What happens to people who can't prove their visa status on demand? Do we just trust their word or are they detained?

I'm skeptical that checking people's citizenship could get past even this SCOTUS.

Cost, what to do with people that don't cooperate, what to do with people from countries that womt accept them back, what are you doing with US citizens that wont cooperate, are you doing with people that don't have proof but claim to be citizens, where are we putting people pending deportation at each step on the way out of the country, and back to cost.

You can't claim to care about the budget and deficit and support this.

You can just look at the math and understand this is an impossible task. Deporting 10000000 people means three thousand a day for ten years. Obviously that's ridiculous, but the GOP is fixated on "plans" that won't possibly work.

I'll be glad to answer this question on how I would do it if I was President and will do so later today (have an errand to run). Note that I'll not be answering as Trump. I'll reframe the question as "how would President Edward deal with illegal immigration".

I'll assume we'll have a back-and-forth, both doing Q&A without any attacks on person (vs position). Let me know if this is acceptable (or not) to you.

Because I plan to ask you for your solutions, my question to you when we continue this discussion is:


In anticipation of someone complaining about me, let me know if you want to move this over to the Immigration thread. If you want to keep it here, no problem.

Oh, in another anticipation of "can't do it, it's impossible", I'll just refer to the Immigration thread where I said

I will be civil and I think a discussion here is fitting given the context of the conversation.

I would put the problem at a 5. I think we need a way to process asylum claims much faster. I also think we need these people here to prop up our economy so it is necessary. I think the GOP uses this as a boogeyman (caravans, emptying insane asylums, rapists and thugs, etc....) to frighten people when almost all of these people are here to escape horrific conditions and make a better life for them and their families.

So it looks like some of the attendees at a Trump rally in Arizona are having problems with their eyes:


Trump rally goers suffer mysterious eye injuries: 'I can't see anything' - Raw Story

thats the risk you take sitting behind Trump

They're not concerned, because white people will never get carded.

Making America great again, via the citizenship checkpoints, school metal detectors, armed teachers and abortion bounties, just like we all remember from our youth.

So being able to deport millions from our country is a sign of American greatness on par with the moon landing?

I honestly don't even understand the point being made there.

Are you OK with US citizens being detained because they don't have their citizenship papers on them?

Sounds like all time terrible human being Mark Robinson may be dropping from the race. CNN reportedly about to drop a bombshell on him.

Apparently (this is stuff I'm reading, so I don't know) the deadline to drop out is TONIGHT, so they (Robinson and the GOP) have to decide really quickly.

Seems like a bit of a gift from CNN to leak the story to him while he still had time to get out.

And considering everything else that we know about Robinson, what the hell can this dealbreaking bombshell be?

I’m
Seeing something to do with an online adult site. His campaign is denying it. Apparently he can drop out but his name can’t be removed from the ballot and his opponent leaked the story. I suspect it was today on purpose. I also read the Trump campaign told him they don’t want him to appear at rallies for Trump or Vance. When even Trump thinks you’re toxic it’s pretty bad.

The crazy thing is, his GOP primary opponents were real and credible politicians. I have no idea why they didn't attack Robinson with all of this (not hard to find) stuff during the primary.

The timing makes it seem more like the leak came from the GOP. Why wouldn't the Dem wait one more day?

What I was thinking as well. Maybe Republicans leaked it preemptively knowing the Democrats has it?

NC supreme ct apparently has ruled they can’t reprint the ballots so my assumption is do it today when he can still drop to get maximum chaos as opposed to when he can’t drop and it being another scandal .

This is the guy Trump said was better than MLK.

He just released a video denying the allegations and saying he refuses to drop out.


Edit: He quotes Clarence Thomas, saying it is a "high-tech lynching."

According to this article it was his opponents campaign

Robinson under pressure to withdraw from gubernatorial race

I think that's too risky when you're already winning by a ton. Not disagreeing that he did it, but I think that was the wrong move strategically.

Between this and Cunningham in 2020, is it a NC thing to end up with a sex scandal at the last minute?

Royce White says hold my beer

This will all be a lot less funny in 4 years when he’s the GOP nominee for President and leading in 5 of 6 swing states.

Or Trump names him to the Supreme Court.

Yeah, the GOP is tryna get him outta there. Singin' all over the place.

New from me: Mark Robinson's email address was also registered on Ashley Madison, the website for married people seeking affairs. A adviser confirmed the email address belongs to him. https://t.co/GgribTrakS

— Natalie Allison (@natalie_allison) September 19, 2024

Now, it could be that someone signed him up for it for just this kinda thing (but if it was confirmed, then, yeah)

Who is "A adviser?"

EDIT: I see further down it specifies "An adviser to the North Carolina Republican"

Lol...

Best friends ❤️ pic.twitter.com/baS5sRfzIo

— Kamala HQ (@KamalaHQ) September 19, 2024

Best reaction: Vance also has an account, but he thought it was Ashley's Furniture.

There is now a fun real-time race: NC Republican candidates for office trying to delete pictures on social media with Robinson vs the people tryna screen shot them before they get taken down. It appears that the screen shotters are holding their own.

If the Harris campaign doesn't absolutely blast NC with ads showing Trump calling Robinson MLK on steroids nonstop it's political malpractice.

Robinson is claiming that all of it was done with AI. The problem is that these are on forums with dates from 14 years ago. It can be verified that they have been there for over a decade. Unless someone has a time machine AI, then that can't be the case. And if they do have a time machine AI, why did they not go back 14 years ago and buy me a couple hundred shares of Nvidia and some Bitcoin?

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Big fan of Ronald Reagan. One of the best presidents we ever had.

That’s fair.

I’d say that’s also on par with a 1-10 scale of “best interests of the USA” with 10 being, “The USA is pretty awesome” and 1 being, “The USA can burn in hell”.

Ironically, I am a big fan of the USA’s #1 rank on legal immigration (with our 1,000,000 quota per year being nearly twice that of Germany, the second most generous nation on earth). The majority of legal immigrants are Catholics coming from Mexico, Central & South America and most of the rest are eastern Asia.

For anybody to be against securing the border and allowing immigration to work as our bi-partisan lawmakers have said it works best simply doesn’t have the best interest of the nation at heart.

Assumptions

1) Using the 80-20 rule, I assume 80% are law abiding and 20% have some sort of ding against them (e.g. felonies, known cartel associate etc.). Using 11M illegals as baseline, that means 8.8M vs 2.2M.
2) We do not need to give path to citizenship for illegals. We only need to give legal status such as renewable guest worker status (e.g. no voting rights). The only exception I can think of is DACA, give them citizenship
3) This is one time program only. Won't ever happen again. Any illegals after X date will be kicked out
4) Members have pointed out question of constitutionality or legal standing of X, Y, Z. Sure, any of these actions will be challenged in courts and SCOTUS will make the final ruling. Shouldn't stop us from trying to get a solution
5) There's always going to be some exception to the rule e.g. I'd probably give DACA citizenship ... even if they've committed felonies. Maybe some extreme hardship cases


As President Edward

6) Implement a holistic immigration reform program (see the Immigration thread for my ideas). This goes hand in hand with the below steps to get rid of illegals.
7) One key reform from #6 is to create/consolidate key pieces of info from all system/databases (social security, visa, immigration, Border Patrol, Homeland security, Prison etc.). I can pick a gun, get a background check done, and out the store in 20 min. If we can do that, we can certainly consolidate all the info to check legal status assuming there is funding and political will. Won't be perfect, but certainly better than what we have now
8) All US citizens/PR get a nice check box on their driver's license or some other card or digital method

9) Ask the 80% to step forward, process them from illegal to guest worker assuming they pass and eligible, see #1. They get ID cards they need to carry around everywhere
10) For the 20% baddies, focus law enforcement on capturing them and tossing them out. Their native country don't want them? I like the idea of paying their one-way ticket to Rwanda (aka the failed UK solution) or giving them an option to join the French/Ukraine Foreign Legion or ask the Vatican to take some since Pope Francis talks a good game. Whatever, given enough time and money, we can probably repatriate vast majority

Why is all this Robinson stuff such a surprise? It's been out there for awhile. I do find it funny that the Ashley Madison stuff is an issue in the age of Trump. Why is this an issue for everybody but Trump? I don't get it. Even my Trumpy SIL wasn't going to vote for Robinson (i assume she was going to leave it blank).

I've collected your questions and have answered them individually ...

Per #1, 80% will be invited to apply for guest worker status. For the remaining 20%, track them down. Expand whatever agency, give them the funds, and tell them to get it done. So no, not stopping people for no reason to ask for papers. But yeah, if you or me or some Latino are stopped for speeding, want to vote, buy a car, open a bank account etc. checking legal status will be part of the process.

I disagree with you on the Wall. I agree with you on Trump's solution ... we know he's a BS'er.

I don't see how my above solution will be violating the rights of Americans. Sure, there'll be some exceptions but for the most part, most American's will be okay albeit slight inconvenience at times.

But yes, I do believe you have to break a few eggs to make an omelet. The initial Obamacare that passed broke alot of eggs to make the omelet. GOP challenged and eventually the individual mandate was found to be unconstitutional. If I propose a program, get it passed by Congress (somehow), I'll let the final constitutionality be determined by SCOTUS.

Same with Joe's student debt forgiveness. He proposed it, got shot down. He went around it, got $100B - $150B forgiven (?) and was recently forced to stop again. Another example of how Presidents break eggs to try get the omelet done.

I do not speak for Trump. My plan is focused on the 20% or 2.2M. Create or fund an agency to track them down, kick them out. We can spend $100B to $150B on student debt forgiveness, we can spend that money on this specific law enforcement.

Low hanging fruit are the illegals in jail. Should be easy enough to monitor and then eventually toss out.

Their home country don't want them back? The UK plan to send unwanted to Rwanda is a creative option, only stopped by a new political party that came into power. If there is a political will and money, I'm sure we can find some country to take them.

Quote:

On 15 November 2023, the UK’s Supreme Court declared the policy unlawful because Rwanda was not a safe country to which asylum seekers could be removed. In response to the judgment of the Supreme Court, the government published a new treaty with Rwanda, which provides for additional safeguards, and introduced new legislation, which declares that Rwanda is a safe country for asylum seekers. On 25 April 2024, the UK’s treaty with Rwanda was ratified, and the Safety of Rwanda (Asylum and Immigration) Act 2024 became law and is now in force. Since winning the 2024 general election and forming the new government, the Labour Party has cancelled the Rwanda scheme. It has announced that it will redirect money intended for the scheme to fund a new border agency.

So my question to you is:

You've acknowledged there is an illegal immigration problem. Does it rise to the level where you believe something needs to be done? And if so, what is your proposed solution?

You may not understand the point because this is a conversation from the Immigration thread. Some here say it cannot be done because of how many illegals there are in the country.

That may be true, but there are always creative solutions. It may not get 100% but if it gets us 80% there, that's pretty good.

Hence, you cannot start with a vision/objective and say "can't be done, it's impossible" and not even try. You start with the vision/objective and then brainstorm on what the options are, come up with some assumptions, budget, risks etc. then go talk to your boss.


So, assuming everyone has a check box on their drivers license (or some other card), and they are asked for it when you and I are normally asked for it (traffic stop, bank transaction, TSA etc.), what is the problem?

I certainly do not expect the bank teller to jump over the counter and perform a citizen's arrest. But yeah, illegal on a traffic stop that don't have a drivers license (or unwilling to present it), sure detain him ... that's what happens to US citizens already (I watch a lot of police YT videos).


Question to you, same one I asked Lathum

Erik Erickson says these stories were known by the Republicans in the primary race, but they did not use them. He says they knew that Trump would endorse him, and these stories would not have stopped the endorsement. He also said this is just the beginning. The next group of revelations are financial improprieties.

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The specifics may or may not have been known or public, but the underlying substance has been out there for months - mostly straight from this POS's own mouth.

Eh, Diddy is more compelling. Think of all the important people he's got on tape!

The guy is the Lt Gov. He didn't crawl out of the forest.

This wasn't particularly difficult to find. He used same screen name on this message board that he uses for Youtube and other accounts. It was also tied to an email address that the campaign confirmed is one he uses.

Is there any data to support the 80-20 rule? I’ve honestly never heard of that in regard to immigration and crime.

Not that I know of. I often use 80-20 as a generalization.

Do you have an opinion on what the ratio is?

95-5? Maybe 99-1? Considering every study I have seen, says undocumented immigrants commit crimes at lower rate than citizens, i would think it is pretty low.

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Fine, that works great for me. Actually makes the logistics for my plan even easier.

If you took a plan to your boss that would cost 25-50% of your total annual budget, drop your revenue, and have no viable path to getting it done, you'd be fired and laughed out of the building.

You want to do something extraordinary, it's on you to present how this is somehow doable. Not just say "good ol' American ingenuity will get us through it".

Not a single person, not here, not in the Trump administration, not in Congress, or anywhere else has been able to present a plan on what it would look like. Why do you think that is?



What checkbox? It doesn't currently exist. If you want to create that on an existing form of ID then I suggest you look into the rollout of REAL ID and how that's gone.



You can be detained on reasonable suspicion of committing a crime. Being in the US in violation of immigration laws is not a crime. If you want to move forward on making that a federal crime, what would you consider reasonable suspicion to be that doesn't involve not being white?

Driver's license for most doesn't prove citizenship. Are you willing to detain everyone who can't prove citizenship when stopped? What's the process to allow them to get/show citizenship?

See above my 2 section reply to Lathum. Let me know what you don't like about my proposed plan?

See above my 2 section reply to Lathum.

Huh? My example was a traffic stop. If a white guy does not have a drivers license or unwilling to present one, that person will be detained until the cop figures out who that person is. What is unreasonable about that?

re: violation of immigration laws is not a crime? Sound like you are only 45% right, see below.



I'll re-ask my question to you, same one I asked Lathum

It's pretty obvious you didn't read my reply to Lathum.

For your first question re: driver's license, start with #7 and #8

I'll ask you same question I asked Lathum

Before any of this stuff, he had posted straight-up Holocaust denial nonsense, said the civil rights moment was “crap,” said that he wished we could go back to when women couldn’t vote, declared that the movie Black Panther was created by the Jews to extract every last shekel from your pockets, had admitted to paying for an abortion, has a porn store worker here in Greensboro claiming that Robinson owes him money for the tab he ran up there, has had serious financial mismanagement revealed (don’t recall all the details…maybe a bankruptcy or two,) and I’m sure I’m leaving out at least one or two other things.

Bottom Line: there’s absolutely nothing revealed today that’s remotely surprising to anyone who has been paying attention to this race and isn’t a hopeless partisan. All of this is consistent with his previously-known words and deeds.

We've been trying to implement Real ID that could also serve as proof of citizenship, but we haven't gotten it done for years. In part that's because conservatives won't agree to a national ID. How do you overcome that?

Number is 6 would never happen. We can't get REAL ID off the ground because you're talking about getting 50 states and multiple agencies on the same page, it would take many many years, drain money, and administrations get tired of the money sink and eventually pull funding. Don't believe it? That's exactly what's been going on with REAL ID. Then you add in the GOP seeing this as government tracking akin to vaccine chips from Bill Gates and good luck.

We're 20 years into REAL ID and you effectively want to start that process all over again with even more challenges. If something ever had a less than zero percent chance of happening, this would be it.





You don't think that driving while not being white wouldn't become a crime in significant portions of the country under something like this?



I'm not 45% right. In your scenario, if I didn't produce my proof of citizenship I'd be in violation of immigration laws. That's not a crime.


People that are already here? A one, if that. They commit crimes at significantly lower rate than the general population, pay into social security and our tax systems, with either nothing or relatively little in return, and boost production.

People currently entering? Maybe a 5. We should do something, but spending trillions to remove people already here is about dumbest use of money I can think of. Beefing up border security using technology, increasing the number of judges on the border to clear the 3 million backlog there, cleaning up the terrorist watch list, and then increasing legal immigration and create better paths to citizenship would incentivize coming in the right way and be a much better and more effective use of funds.

Surprised Trump didn't just abuse the 100 mile border enforcement zone for warrantless searches. Probably not enough money.

today's Morning Consult poll has Allred ahead of Cruz in the Texas Senate race

All of this.

So, he's 56, which is contemporary for a lot of us. I theorize that there's an age band of people, which would include most of us, who known enough about anonymity online that we wouldn't have made these kind of mistakes (if we were so inclined to indulge in these activities). I mean, we've had (in the distant past) some doxxing issues on this board.

Clearly Boomers are generally fucked when it comes to this stuff, but I also think a lot of "digital natives" (maybe the generations after millennials) are too naive about online anonymity.

Which, besides the general philosophising I've just indulged in, makes the whole thing extra funny because he really should have known better. Is he just arrogant? Stupid? Both?

The NCGOP has gone all in defending Robinson. He's not going anywhere.

Thanks for your detailed response.

You still don't really address how to avoid getting actual citizens caught up in this.

I question the 80-20, I think it is more like 98-2, but regardless what makes you think the 80% trusts our government that they would step up and join the program? Lets say they do and you have to track down the rest. What does that look like? These people are undocumented so it isn't like you can easily find them. It would 100% turn into gestapo like BS where every brown person is harassed by not only law enforcement, but everyday "patriots" who feel it is their duty to defend 'murica.

By all accounts migrants commit crimes at far less than Americans, so I don't think the ones here are an issue. Most of them are doing work Americans will not do for wages Americans will not work for. Can you say it is immoral for the economy to be propped up by cheap migrant labor, perhaps, but it has always been that way, which is why it won't change. You REALLY want to go after illegals, go after the people employing them, which won't happen because those people have the politicians in their pockets. Not to mention these migrants pay into a system they will never benefit from.

As for current crossings use tech, drones, cameras, inferred, etc....hire more agents, and set up a long term plan to help stabilize the nations these people are coming from. That money would be far better spent than rounding up the ones here who will just come back.

And back to my biggest point. It would literally be impossible to do this without violating a significant number of Americans civil liberties. You call it an "inconvenience" but for the people illegally detained and possible deported itis far more than that.

Sorry if that is a bit stream of concious, been a long day.

Oprah looks pretty amazing for her age. She looks just like she did when she was on tv every day.

Party of family values!!

I am really hoping he drags the ticket down enough Harris has a shot.

I'm fine with this. I've used 80-20 as a general rule of thumb in many different discussions, if we want to assume 98-2 (approx 220k baddies), I'm good with that.

It'll be up to my team working with the organizations/agencies/advocates for illegals to convince the 98% to join up. Ala Ben Franklin's change management/communication programs.

I'm sure there'll be many who will wait till the tail end of the "signup" period to make sure things are legit. I'd also think bipartisan Congress agreeing on my bill and the stipulation this is the very last time/chance would encourage vast majority of the 98% to buy in.


The rest in this case is the 2% of baddies or 220k. You (and others) are thinking I'm proposing a mass canvassing of all minorities, detain them, and check their background. I'm not.

98% are taken care of. There is a certain % of the 2% already in jail, many of the 220k baddies will have a record. Why can't we send LEOs to track them down? They won't be able to easily buy cars, rent apartments, cash checks, get credit cards etc. They'll get arrested if they commit a traffic violation, shoplift, bar fight (e.g. all the police YT videos) or worse (e.g. shooting, drugs). When we catch them, ship them off.

Over time, the 2% will get less and less. And because we are not allowing any other illegals in after X date, their percent will get smaller and smaller.

I agree illegals commit less crimes than Americans (other than entering the country illegally). Keep in mind I'm saying swap the 98% illegals (who are law abiding) into guest workers. They will continue to do what they do. With an increase in guest worker quotas, more will come.

If your point is that when we legalize the 98% into guest workers, they will need to be paid more and therefore costs of fruits, vegetables, chicken etc. will go up? Sure. Heck, Chinese restaurant entrees used to be $12-$14 and now $18-$22. I'm okay with that assuming the illegal immigration problem is fixed and border secured once and for all.

I agree with this. I mentioned in my response to you there needs to be holistic immigration reform also. You'll see I mentioned this here Front Office Football Central - View Single Post - Biden's Immigration Reform

I agree on first sentence. The ones that come back is because we have a lousy enforcement.

I'll refer you to above 3rd paragraph, see start of "The rest in this case is the 2% of baddies or 220k. You (and others) are thinking I'm proposing a mass canvassing of all minorities, detain them, and check their background. I'm not."

I don't see how my plan is violating a significant number of American civil liberties.

For the 98%, if I have a traffic stop or cash a check or vote or buy a car or countless other stuff, I have to show an ID. My proposal is to create a check box on the ID that okays you. Yes, there will be bugs, wrong info etc. but it'll work itself out after several years and data cleanup

For the 2% baddies, have law enforcement focus on them, track them down with our new consolidated database of info and newly funded agency.


Question to you:

Are you okay with legalizing the 98% law abiding illegals with a renewable guest worker visa. Essentially, legal status but no pathway to citizenship or voting in elections?

Your plan completely falls apart because the GOP doesn't want the 98% to gain any sort of status. It is pie in the sky. The GOP is fueled by hatred of anyone non white so anything that gives them a moniker of rights to be here is a non starter.

dola- and while I appreciate you outlining what you would do, you aren't candidate for president. Trump is and he is trying to sell a bill of goods that he has zero chance to deliver. It should bother anyone with a brain that a large portion of Americans support this and think it is feasible.

#6 is holistic immigration reform. It can happen if there is political will and compromise.

If you are referring to #7 and my proposed super-duper consolidated database, all it takes is political will, funding and the right consulting companies. I'm pretty sure my former company Accenture can implement this if there is political will and funding ... its not a technology problem.

Nope.

Specifically to driving, no reason for cop to stop you unless you had a traffic violation. In that situation, you are legally obliged to provide driver's license (aka the checkbox), registration, insurance. If you can't, you will be detained until the LEO figures out who you are. If the cop stops you for no good reason, or doesn't follow the law, then get Morgan & Morgan, get the body cam video that every cop has, and sue.

I did not say that. I said if a cop stopped you and you did not produce a driver's license (aka with the checkbox), then the cop can detain you to figure who you are. Detaining people without a driver's license happens now to anyone.

My quote was me responding to what you said

Quote:

Being in the US in violation of immigration laws is not a crime.

My quote says below. Since 45% did not enter illegally, this means 55% of illegal immigrants did enter illegally and is a crime.

Quote:

Entering the United States without being inspected and admitted, i.e., illegal entry, is a misdemeanor or can be a felony, depending on the circumstances. 8 U.S.C. § 1325. Current estimates are that approximately 45% of undocumented immigrants did not enter illegal

Okay, good context for where you are coming from.

Question to you:

Are you okay with legalizing the 98% law abiding illegals with a renewable guest worker visa. Essentially, legal status but no pathway to citizenship or voting in elections?

Yes, I know you and others here have made that same argument. I'll just quote myself from back then

I know you know this already but for the benefit of others, my response to Lathum was based on the below caveat

Yes, if Dems decided to vote for deportations then they would pass. The problem is that won't happen and the GOP is against most of what you propose, work permits, legalizing anyone, increased legal immigration, etc.

RFK Jr. really fits well with Trump.


The problem for the magazine is that Nuzzi was covering RFK Jr.

As a naturalized citizen who has travelled extensively and lived & visited in many countries, my personal opinion is many Americans do not understand how very fortunate they are.

America is truly the land of opportunity, warts and all.

Seems so common sense to me.

Dems don't need to vote for deportation. They just need to say no to pathway to citizenship

I appreciate the respectful and informative discussion on this issue.

RFK Jr fitting in nicely with the Trump campaign I see...

They did and the GOP still killed this latest immigration bill.

GOP was trying to get Nebraska to change to winner take all (which would lose Harris the single Omaha vote--critical b/c that forces her to win one swing state outside the Midwest blue wall). But that went away when Maine said that if Nebraska did that, then it would switch to winner take all (losing Trump the single rural Maine vote).

But apparently Maine's constitution has some deadline for legislation to take effect, which passed a few days ago, so Maine cannot (without GOP help) change its system now.

So, in a brilliant political move, the GOP has suddenly decided to raise the issue again, up to and including US Senators going there to lobby for it.

Sneaky as hell. But also seems legit. Politics ain't beanbag.

Same people who complained about states changing their rule during covid. Bunch of hypocrites.

Too bad the last immigration bill was focused on just border security and not the 11M illegals. Now if the Dems (and GOP) agreed on no legalization in the more comprehensive Dignity Act The Dignity Act: Bill Summary - National Immigration Forum

I mean, if you read carefully, that's what the quote is about that you reacted to?

There is no world where MAGA will pass anything with a pass to citizenship. They need their immigrant sacrifice.

That's why you need to vote for me in 2028. I have decided to run as an Independent, let me know what cabinet position you want.

Whichever one is in charge of the National Parks. I'd love to go on a two-week "factfinding" trip to Yellowstone as part of my "job."

Done. You'll be Secretary of the Interior.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United...f_the_Interior

I challenge anyone claiming the economy is bad to stand outside an Apple Store today where they are releasing the new iPhone.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...count-ballots/

"Pro-Trump Georgia election board votes to require hand counts of ballots"

Yeah, that'll go well.