Best i could find for an Overview in english:

Coronavirus destroys lungs. But doctors are finding its damage in kidneys, hearts and elsewhere. - SFGate

Coronavirus may cause lasting damage throughout body, doctors fear - The Jerusalem Post

More Bad News on the Long-Term Effects of the Coronavirus


It still could be overreaction simply because of the scope of scrutiny and it being so new of course and in a year it turns out people are largely back to normal. The lung is a damn resillient organ with lots of healing power.
Still, seems prudent to keep in mind when people take the "well, only old people die" approach to extremes.
Lots of shitty effects come from illnesses that don't kill you, too.

Yeah, as I mentioned, most sources blame the end of the war for cases due to parades, etc., but all data (limited) I found, while the second wave overlapped the end of the war, the second wave in most areas preceded it by a month.

We are studying this in my lab and yes, there is lots of damage outside the lungs.

I have a question: Do your supermarkets have protective barriers for the cashiers ? (Like acryllic glas). Read this article and saw the picture without one, which seems crazy considering how cheap and easy to install it is (just hang it from the ceiling)...

Experts say it may be time for grocery stores to ban customers from coming inside - CNN

I think it is up to the market. Ours do here but I am in New Jersey.

Daryl Morey on Twitter: "… "

The number of reported cases has really jumped in Ohio the last couple days. Now I'm worried again about the governor shutting my job down.

At least the percentage increase in deaths has slowed.

Is China going to get pissed at the NBA and people take completely the wrong lesson from this Tweet, too?

SI

The virus has me thinking about trying Nutrisytem again, at least doing that would cut out the majority of my grocery shopping.

https://apnews.com/4f0a4ca93cc2fee94d386efb13db31a0
Headline: "‘Cartels are scrambling’: Virus snarls global drug trade"




SI

Deaths are a lagging indicator by 2 to 3 weeks. Sadly if your cases jumped today, your death toll realistically will jump proportionally to that.

Will you try this Soylent thing and let me know Forbidden :)

FWIW, I'm gaining weight. Snacking all the fraking time.

It is possible it could be a reporting issue though. I'd wait a few more days and see if it's a sustained increase before I really got worried.

Saw the same thing, there is an article about it spreading in a Marion County jail. I wonder if that is driving the numbers?

EDIT: Just read this morning, that is driving the spike in numbers.

Keep on protesting KY and folks anywhere else for that matter, I'm sure COVID-19 will see your signs and leave your area.

https://www.kentucky.com/news/corona...242124556.html

Well deaths are way down so far today so maybe we are starting to see the end of high death rate tunnel.

Italy with less active cases than the day before for the first time.

Germany opened small businesses and people ignore that small finger and grab the whole hand from what i have seen. Plus media pushing stories about possible Summer vacation, Bundesliga might start soon with empty stadiums (but you just know there will be private viewing Parties)
Think we might be fucked without some major Breaks, people just utterly disapointingly unable to heed simple rules and limit themselves in their free time. If everybody was dilligent there, it would be much easier to allow/do more essential stuff like work and family meetings.

That's the fear I had with gradual reopening. People just going hogwild while if they were more cautious things would be ok.

We have seen the runs on TP and baking goods. I predict the next one will be sunscreen.

And Kentucky is officially done with in person classes for the rest of this school year. Not surprised, but disappointed. I really never thought they would go back, but had hoped they'd get the chance.

I feel like our governor in NJ has been pretty proactive in his responses. It is really odd that they haven't called school for the year yet. I just wish they would get it over with at this point.

In the school district my daughter is at they basically said a student can't get lower grade than what they had going into the pause. My daughter has all A's so she is effectively done with her senior year.

She has been accepted to her college of choice. Unknown how that will work out in Aug/Sep though.

Oh God, our Governor (Georgia) is a moron. We are starting reopening on Friday, with gyms (YES, gyms!), salons, bowling alleys and then also restaurant and theaters with 'guidelines'. Our cases are rising daily... this is insane!

If we reopen without gauging it to metrics and without a plan for testing and tracing, it really will have all been for nothing.

Unlikely. We're living on the edge now, why fear skin cancer when COVID-19 is out there to kill you before the cancer can even spread?

Bowling alleys??

Apparently it's really important to open bowling alleys for some reason... I wonder if some bowling guy gave a big donation to Kemp.

I wouldn't imagine the (any) state would have more than like, four "bowling guys" at this point.

I've been complaining about him for weeks. This won't change what I do, not going anywhere still. I know it sucks for everyone, I haven't really gone anywhere for 5 weeks, but if we just do this until the end of May, we probably could be in pretty good shape. Now we are going to open too early and have to do this again.

So, why aren’t they opening up all their pro and college stadiums for games?

All the talk about playing sports without fans is mute, no?

Our Governor(McMaster) is also a moron:

403 - Forbidden

I am truly flabbergasted.

South Carolina's seems a lot saner... opening small retail businesses with restrictions on them, giving discretion to local municipalities to open/close beaches etc as they see fit, and still having police with the authority to disperse even groups as small as 3 people.

But if Mayor A opens his beach and Mayor B doesn't, won't the results be Mayor As beach is twice as crowded potentially creating a worse public health crisis?

I live on the Jersey shore, people who want to go to the beach will travel a fuw towns over, or farther even.

I still don't think the Governors or Mayors are going to have that much say. This is still going to be a bottom up decision. Just don't see that many people sitting down at a busy restaurant even if they can.

My guess the decision on gyms has to do with memberships and someone lobbying hard. They don't like refunding money and now they can claim they're open for all the people who don't want to risk coming in and working out.

The chain theaters and gyms closed before they were ordered to, I wouldn't expect them to rush out and open as soon as they can in the handful of states where it's allowed. It would make more sense for the national chain theaters to do a coordinated launch. I don't if the gyms are more of an independent franchise thing, but I'd expect them to have national rules and timelines too.

Myrtle Beach said they'd keep them closed, wouldn't surprise me if it broke down along those lines - places where people might come from out of the area to stay could keep them closed, but small towns open up for local residents. I could see it being an issue with Lake Wylie right across the border from Charlotte, and that highlighting how state borders aren't exactly the best way to do things, but with the cat out of the bag it's not the worst thing to have different states trying different approaches.

Correct because its going to happen here in Myrtle, Myrtle Mayor said no to reopening, N. Myrtle said yes, still waiting to hear from others.

These protesters that want to open the country up. I saw a report today and the woman was complaining she lost her job. My daughter just got a job at Wal-Mart. Yes, the government just gave you an extra $600 but dont bitch about it and instead of protesting, go apply for a job.

F-ing idiots. This country is far fro shit down

And if states are starting to reopen, in two weeks it'll explode again.

Milwaukee has recorded 7 cases linked to in person voting.

So I have a friend who is a doctor and administrator at Emory, one of the largest hospital systems in Metro Atlanta (I think only Piedmont is larger?). He said their ICU beds are full. Opening the state up now is such a bad idea - how about waiting until ICU capacity isn't at max already?

That's not mentioning how South GA (Albany) is one of the big flash points in the county and hasn't slowed down.

Shouldn't the curve flatten even a little bit before you think of doing this?

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

wow in metro atlanta?

I was thinking that the cities are the ones that are finally coming to that peak and MAYBE going down (if they were isolating) and the rural areas are this week coming up the hill of sickbursts.

yikes

Then this makes even less sense to open up. I assumed that hospital and ICU rates were declining, but it’s not like we got any information from the governor about that like they are getting in New York daily.

If you want to see what they did in Taiwan to crush the curve, I found this interesting reading:

https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coron...e-b8420170203e


amongst the things Taiwan did BEFORE the city of Wuhan shutdown


during the pandemic?


Let's go through that next to last one. This was a first person account of someone who traveled to Taiwan during the pandemic.


That is the reason that Taiwan sports were able to resume. Now, without getting political, would you see ANY of the things that Taiwan did working in the US?

I talked to a Critical Care Nurse that works for the Atlanta VA today. He told me that normally they see about one death every month. They are currently seeing six a day. He said most of the staff have worked in war zone, but they are not prepared for this. They have called counselors in for support. Good thing our governor wants to open the state back up to make it worse.

I need a haircut but will wait 2-3 weeks to see if cases continue to decrease and if hospitals/ICU/ventilators/healthcare workers are more freed up.

My problem with Kemp is there is no communication. In my line of work, we impact a lot of people with "change". So we tell people change is coming, we tell them what the change is, why the change is happening, how it will impact them, train them for the change, measure their acceptance of the change etc. and then update & mitigate as needed.

On Sun/Mon, Kemp says we are opening up this Fri and here minimal details. But there are no real details, no planning, no training or rules yet. If people could see there was a plan, I can see it being accepted and adhered to better.

Oh, it's even worse.. the Governor like 4 days ago converted the Georgia World Congress Center into a makeshift hospital:

Coronavirus Updates: 200-Bed Surge Hospital Nears Opening At World Congress Center | 90.1 FM WABE

Which just started taking patients this weekend:

Georgia Has Started Treating Coronavirus Patients In Atlanta's Convention Center | 90.1 FM WABE

So you open a makeshift 200 bed hospital in the Convention Center and then a few days later talk about opening things up?! How does any of this make sense?!

And Atlanta started a bit later than the California cities and NYC. We are just starting to get into the peak, whereas Albany GA (for whatever reason) has been really bad well earlier than Atlanta.

It’s almost as if a governor who won a rigged election isn’t qualified.

And apparently mayors in Georgia weren't told about this before he said it. Which is terrible in terms of planning. Now mayors have to figure out how to get ahead of it in 5 days - without being able to set more stringent restrictions for flash point cities.

The List of stuff opening in Georgia reads like he got a recommendation and his assistant forgot to copy the title "This should be opened last" and the bottom saying "bars and nightclubs".

Yup and I think we are seeing how under qualified a lot of our leaders are in this country. It is really easy to be a governor of the state when you don't really have to do much and just collect a pay check, but when the shit hits the fan, are you going to step up and lead or are you going to make the problem worse with your lack of leadership. We are seeing this play out in many states.

I wonder if this will have any impact going forward if people will elect people that are qualified or it will just continue along party lines. Unfortunately, most likely nothing will change.

This is true on both sides of the aisle. Democrat and Republican leaders are the same in this regard. They are so beholden to their donors, they do not have the ability to think and lead on their own. Many of these guys are selected to be the front runner because they are photogenic and charismatic, but the ability to lead does not necessarily require either of these (although charisma does help).

Not sure if I related this here or at another forum, but a few years back, it must have been 2017, I was flying next to a Republican election consultant. He was grilling me on why I was drifting away from the party despite being conservative. I pointed out a number of issues, too long to list here, but the upshot of all this, he started discussing the candidates and how these guys act when the lights are not on them.

Essentially, these guys have been so programmed what to say, they cannot think on their feet. Its why debates are worthless today. Candidates have a list of talking points to talk to, and if they go off script, things go south in a hurry. The donors pick telegenic people they think voters can connect to. Its why the parties are so quick to elevate and then discard candidates, they are trying to find out who more people get behind so the donor's agenda can be driven forward.

It was all pretty fascinating stuff and completely changed my view of candidates.

You're seeing other forums? Wow.

We will not be your cuckold!

I'm not sure sports being played without spectators is a good metric. With the billions of dollars on the line & small rosters there's no reason the NBA couldn't quarantine a small island or a big ranch and play games with no spectators. Not all of the players would want to self isolate with their teammates like that, and the owners don't want to do it because they'd lose a ton in start up costs and not having fans, but the logistics on that seem a lot easier than stopping countrywide spread.

I really disliked our governor in Illinois until this crisis. I've really grown to respect men like Cuomo and Pritzker.

Seems like a way to get people off unemployment by picking who he believes are the most expendable people in the state.

for a 368-person study, a 10% difference in results doesn't seem that significant. But I do agree that there is no evidence to support using hydroxychloroquine with or without the azithromycin for COVID-19. That point needs to made clear if people are trying to use it off the books.

Trump sucks and is the worst before the response comes back to him but why the love for Coumo besides his political party? His state's numbers are worse than most countries and he is on record as saying this is no different than the flu as well. Guess I just dont get the love. (Well I mean I understand the media hype but not why ordinary people love him)

I don't get the love for Cuomo per se and most media rankings of the best Governor responses don't include Cuomo - usually its DeWine, Newsom, Hogan, Whitmer. I think the way he talks about this stuff is just good news copy.

Because he talks like a grown up.

50% of Trumps problem is his inability to communicate and act like a normal person.

This. We have incredibly low standards in this country.

Inslee, DeWine, and Newsom have handled this much better but are not on TV everyday or in a media hot bed.

Perhaps the discussion of what governors have done well would be better placed in the Trump thread.

Another Tuesday spike, probably due to the weekend reporting issues as before, but if we're past the peak in terms of deaths it isn't by much yet.

Who wants to tell her....

The NIH is recommending not to use it now. Seems to be a trend around the world as more data comes in.

There has been some early promising results from remdesivir from what I'm reading. And I'm sure a bunch of other treatments are being tested around the world. There is no shortage of patients. Hopefully something works.

Nah, looks photo-shopped to me.

We all fail to not go there in this thread ...

So an anecdotal bit of positive news. Obviously the group of people ordering from a shopping service are going to skew towards the more cautious, but so far since I started yesterday almost every order is using the 'drop-off' option, which means no physical contact at all between the shopper and the customer, just set the bags at their door and leave. On the negative side, I'm amazed at the number of other shoppers not wearing masks.

As I stated earlier in this thread, the risks and side effects far outweigh any benefit, and you probably do not need to increase your sample size. I am currently running 2 clinical trials (not on that) and would have long been frozen by the FDA with those kids of AE and SAE reports.

Went to Fresh Thyme Market, every worker and almost all customers wearing masks. Went to Ace Hardware, no workers, almost no customers wearing masks. Ace is sort of like 'everyday' KY, while Fresh Thyme is called "The Hippie Market" by my wife for a reason.

I would say 90% of people here are wearing masks in stores. Big mix between N95, paper, cloth, and just wrapping a scarf around their nose and mouth. People have been pretty good with distancing too.

Not sure how reputable they are but a scary visual.

https://www.thenewatlantis.com/publi...ashes-not-like

So to use your expertise...

Let's say that a drug has a 100% cure rate for CV but the sample size was smaller than this trial. Would they take the chance to rush it to the field or would they still increase the sample size just to make sure? Or whatever option 3 would be?

Our Wal Mart has directional arrows for each aisle which are conveniently ignored by all the boomers.

Well, that initial sample size would really matter. And don't forget, this is the field they are testing it in. So if a drug were to come along and cure 90/90 patients in a reputable place, my guess is that they would expand it greatly (if they could) and get emergency use of this for a much larger trial. They may get around the placebo controlled initially due to the ongoing mortality, but a lot of things like sex, race, age, and other factors would need to be considered. Also, if a drug has already passed Phase I safety trials, it could be pushed out fast with fastracked FDA approvals for a large trial.

I'm sure other countries don't give a rats ass about wanting to come to the US now that we are the biggest carrier of the disease so shutting down immigration is a bit stupid

Thanks for your insight :)

Yeah, absolutely. After all, "curing" someone is pretty hard to prove on an individual basis without context and a good sample group, especially with a still new disease.
I mean, in the french hydrochloquine study everybody in the controll group was 'cured' as well ;) Does that mean that no medication works best ? Obviously not.

And we have already seen drugs approved way faster that other times and maybe even earlier than many are comfortable with. Both Hydrochloroquine and Remdesivir for example. Both were tested for safety, obviously. But just from my obviously layman perspective: that is propably still not equivalent to actually being safe to use here with this specific set of patients with this specific diesease. Because that's not a disease that past tests envisioned it being used for, so nobody could have tested if it is safe for patients being in the shape they are now. Just because the side effects are still considered "safe" for a Malaria or Lupus patient doesn't mean it is safe for a patient suffering from a vastly different disease.

Remdesivir presumably a bit 'closer'/being a better analogue than Hydrochlorquine.

From my experiences shopping at Walmart pre-pandemic I'm pretty sure this isn't intentional ignoring on their part. :-)

Not that we knew it at the time, but autopsy data has pushed back the first U.S. death to Feb. 6 in the San Francisco area.

I am irrationally hopeful about Remdesivir.

Me too. Also on Z-Pak (relatively easily available) but think that may be falling to the wayside.

Well, Z-Paks were never going to be something to treat Coronavirus directly. They would be for secondary infections.

SI

Thank you!

See how coronavirus can spread through a population, and how countries flatten the curve | World news | The Guardian

Very easy and comprehensible, especially if graphics work better than text for you

Good stuff. Thanks for linking to it.

I saw in the RANDOM thread people talking about restaurants. How are people's eating habits changing around this?

I would say we used to eat out pretty much every night. Now we are cooking 5 nights a week and getting carryout about 2. I have been getting drive-thrus for lunch about 3 days a week just for time considerations around work. We live pretty close to several drive-thrus.

The carryout for dinner is from 2 good local restaurants that we're hoping survive. The times I have gotten carryout/delivery from large chains, it has been 50% something wrong with the order. Wrong wing sauce, one time we got only half-cooked chicken breasts, one time an entire missing item. Have yet to have anything go wrong with the good local places.

That's also about the only times I've gone out other than grocery shopping. Also have found it hard to stick to a diet, but that's neither here nor there.

What about you, what are you eating nowadays?

We used to go out for dinner 1-2 times a week. Now we are doing takeout once a week (and every few weeks maybe an additional time). We've changed our Blue Apron meals from every 2 weeks to every week. Started ordering a Misfit Market box for veggies. And are overmaxxing our grocery budget (though it helps our brunch budget has been $0 for the last two months).

I tend to eat out for lunch every day while in the office.. so I'm saving like $50-$60 a week just on that alone. Not to mention the coffee costs.

I've also noticed that I eat too much for lunch. When you spend $10+ on lunch you tend to eat all of it. I eat a couple slices of pizza or some leftovers for lunch and I've lost like 10lbs.

It's been maybe a month since we ate out.

I'm still going into work 3 days per week while the wife is furloughed. No real changes to our dinner plans as we had cut eating out for dinner down to maybe 1 time per week starting a year or so ago.

The wife is saving quite a bit by not eating out for lunch each day and not stopping at Starbucks each morning.

There was a time when we probably ate out 3-4 times a week, and ordered out a couple of times on top of that. As a family of four. That shifted a bit when my wife went to full-time a few years ago (fewer out, more takeout) and obviously changed when my son went to school. Add to that my daughter's eating habits (let's say vegetarian to save time) and we were lucky to go out once a week. Or my wife and I would go out when my daughter was doing her own thing. But we had our usual Monday order from the corner pizza place, Wawa once or twice a week, Chipotle, Domino's (can never have enough pizza!), etc.

At work at one point I'd spend maybe $10/day at the cafeteria, a little more if we went out for lunch or I doubled up and got breakfast and lunch. I started curtailing that a couple of months ago.

During the lockdown, we are pretty much down to the corner pizza place, an occasional order from the corner Mexican place (we'd like to see them stay in business), and a lot of cooking at home. Some of that's cheap ($1 pasta, $1 sauce, $2-$3 garlic toast), some not (Honeybaked ham AND turkey for Easter...). Gotta make more now that the boy is home, but we did get some $700 or so back in meal plan refunds. Overall, we are bound to be spending less. Probably a lot less.

Las Vegas mayor is offering her city up as a control group to see what happens when everything is open.

She is insane

Amazing what happens when the Mayor of a major city is the wife of a mob lawyer. If we learn nothing else from this crisis it's elections have consequences.

Las Vegas Mayor offers city as "control group", "we offer to be a control group" to see how many people die without social distancing. pic.twitter.com/NESE2hActE

— Josh Marshall (@joshtpm) April 22, 2020