The Middle Earth game had four factions, Rangers, Townsfolk of Bree, Agents of Sauron and Agents of Saruman.

Well, that kill made it easier for Capt. Hook, which I'm assuming is part of his victory condition.

Vote Dodgerchick

No tail on Tinkjerbelle

Wait, nm. I thought DC came after cronin, I had it in reverse order, my bad. Sleepy catch ups are bad things.

UNVOTE DODGERCHICK BECUASE IM STUPID

So people can just die out of the blue? Hrm, that's interesting.

well Olie....looks like you gots some explaning to do

Unvote Hoopsguy

Vote Oliegirl


The action on Cronin seems like it could possibly come from Dodgerchick, and I was contemplating voting for her, but this action against Telle
obviously comes from Oliegirl. I don't know that any of us peaceloving folk around here want people randomly trying to kill or injure others. While we all may have various winning conditions, we'll all find it harder to survive if people are trying to kill each other left and right.

Yeah, we need to hear from Olie on this one..

As did I.

I'm holding out voting for Oliegirl until I hear a plausible explination

It's tough because I don't want to say much about my character yet because I have a hunch that at least one bad guy is looking for me. I'm hoping that as the game goes on we'll be learning more about the overall goal and then start to piece together strategies.

Dola, in the meantime I'm trying to find out some things towards my individual goal. I'd be happy to share that once I get some good info.

The information that Alan outlined is pretty consistent with what my objectives are in this game. Find an ally, eliminate a foe.

For what it is worth, I checked Chief Rum last night and he is not my ally. I checked SnDvls today and he is not my ally. Dead Cronin was not my ally. Based on Alan's results searching me, I'm going to guess he is not my ally.

Telle, I've got a potion that I could attempt using on you but I have no idea if it is an antidote - I just know the color of the potion. Care to give me a reason why I would use it on you rather than keep it, move it, whatever?

I was told I had a potion, but was not told what it did or what it's effects were. I was not told if the effects would be positive or negative. I suspected Telle might be the dragon, and since my winning condition includes eliminating the dragon, I took a chance.

For what it is worth, Olie's description of the potion (not knowing what it does or what are the effects) is entirely consistent with mine.

Although if you knew it was a black potion, that doesn't sound all that positive in fairytale land. If you are guessing that Telle was the dragon, then you were hoping the effects would be negative, right?

Problem is that there are quite a few roles that have tails in this game - for example, the pigs (assuming they are around).

What is the basis for thinking that Telle is the Dragon?

I don't really feel good with this story. We've had other people already come out stating they received a potion without information about it, and why would you suspect Telle is the dragon, what has she done to this point that would indicate that to you at all?

This feels pretty far fetched to me and doesn't sound like something I buy very much.

Well that wasn't very nice.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

And I am definitely NOT the dragon and I don't see what would have made you come to such a conclusion.

Yeah I'd want to know more on why Telle, that seems random.

Olie: Why think Telle is a dragon over Dodgerchick who's been accused of having a tail?

I don;t know. Voting Oliegirl seems a bit obvious. SHe had to know that if it turned out bad, she'd be lynched, and no bad guy would do that I dont think. I'm not voting for her right now.

OK, so what do people think is the objective of our lynch today?
1.) Get a wolf?
2.) Get the dragon?
3.) Take out a competing team member?

How far does #3 fall below the other items? Particularly if you are Peter Pan and have lost a teammate at this point? As far as I know, my victory conditions are still intact and I would like to preserve them. But I would rather slow down the wolves and dragon (by a wide margin) than take out competing factions because I'm working under the notion that competing factions are not going to try and kill us at night.

So today we find out that BK wants the dragon dead, an unknown person killed cronin, oliegirl poisoned telle and that several of us found items and don't know what they do... at least I don't.

What's a little confusing is why we know oliegirl poisoned Telle, but don't know cronin's killer? Doesn't make sense to me.

I was just thinking about this and wondered the same. At this point no one knows who is who with the exception of Buttercup, that's if Passacaglia is telling the truth. Unless ppl see hints but I see nothing.

Well I can't speak for everyone else, but as my action indicated, I think our strategy for today needs to try to reclaim some sense of order to our actions. If we all just go off attacking each other, we are handing the game over to the bad guys pretty quickly.

If we want to all vote for people that we are competing against, then thats pretty much almost everyone in I think most people's cases, so thats not really a good strategy and ends up opening the way for groups that are willing or in a position to cooperate (ie: the bad guys).

I don't think we have details on who are the bad guys or who is a wolf or dragon or such... Cronin said that DC has a tail, and then Cronin suddenly died, I would think DC would be a decent choice for a lynch today and almost moved my vote there, before the Oliegirl action happened.. Since my guesses about DC is more based on speculation wheras Oliegirl obviously made her action, thats where I am going today..

lets face it, I found a weapon, others have weapons, some people have potions that may or may not be harmful.. if we all choose randomly to off people, eventually its going to take out someone that is part of -your- winning condition.. in that case who wins? Likely the bad guys I am guessing.

Oliegirl told her explanation which doesn't really even seem plausible to me.. I might feel differently if she had flat out came and said "I scanned Telle, she isn't part of my alliance so I figured I would remove her from the game".. I think I would rather everyone vote off folks than just kill them in that case, but at least it would be more believable...

In my mind right now, I think Oliegirl is where my vote is remaining for two reasons.. 1) I don't think she was telling the truth in her explanation .. and 2) If everyone decides to start attacking people not in their alliance, the bad guys will win.

Someone must have found this crossbow laying somewhere, unless one of the fairy tail creatures carries this and just shot in the dark... as Oliegirl did with Telle, I'm assuming.

I was looking through the list to see who might come equipped with a crossbow. I thought Capn Hook had a sword, don't know about Lord Farquar or Dread Pirate Roberts, or the Evil Mastermind for that matter. I guess Lancelot would have a sword also.

I'm assuming that it's a weapon someone started with, otherwise it seems that someone would have had to scan Cronin as Tinkerbelle, recognize him as an enemy, AND just happen to find a crossbow laying around. Seems unlikely.

Of course, maybe whoever shot him was just wanted to find out what happened or is plain evil and Cronin just was a random target.

Dola, or it could be that it is someone not even on the character list. I know I'm not, for instance.

Well Robin Hood was my first guess when I saw someone hit with a crossbow.. but then.. why would Robin Hood as a good guy take out Cronin after he reported that DC had a tail?

Robin Hood wouldn't have chosen to do it based on a scan of Cronin, and why would a good guy take a shot in the dark at cronin out of the blue instead of say DC? The same logic I apply to why Oliegirl's action smells rotten to me applies here.. So I think after going through that, it likely was a bad guy who got a cross bow on day 1 who chose to use it on day 2 as an action.

Yup, that and because cronin pointed me as having a tail, the assumption would be that I would wanna kill him which is completely untrue.

Wow, I was not expecting the day to progress as it has so far.

Well, everyone has their own winning conditions and I think the actions today are a clear indication of where ppl are going... at least these 2 people. 2 people dead, that's 2 groups that are probably screwed and 2 groups that have an advantage.

Regarding who's good or bad... I'd think that anybody with the innate ability to kill is "bad" in the sense that they are liable to kill you at any time, unless your victory conditions align with theirs. I'd think that nobody is really "good", except for people who share your own victory conditions.

Looking over the list of players, I think there are as many non-bad as bad who have tails. I'd hesitate to read anything into it.

Based on what Render said yesterday, everyone has the ability to "attack" .. whether or not that means successfully kill, I do not know.. The difference is that I think we need to punish people for doing so when it ends up being a good character killed or attacked, especially when the motivations for doing so remain largely unknown.

Well, at this exact moment, I can't see a situation where I'm not voting for DC or Oliegirl. Anyone have any other front-runners for a vote at this time?

I realize that most people have the ability to kill or attack, but I think there's a dividing line between the people who are taking a chance on furthering a victory condition, and people who need to do it every night for a victory condition.

yay, let's kill everyone with a tail! please... you could be killing a furry little bunny for all you know.

dola,

:rolleyes:

I think this is a crucial point.

No, I agree, it's less than ideal, but even you having say a 50/50 shot at being bad because you have a tail (I count 12 listed "tailed" roles, 6 of which would be bad/wolfish) is better than what I have.

Of course that is still pending my making up my mind on the whole Olie situation.

I, of course, have a team oriented victory condition like those people have stated as having above, but I'm so nowhere on it that I can't really even vote based on that end.

That is the thing I am unsure of.. who has a role that they have to kill every night for a victory condition? My guess is that Cpt Hook will have a victory condition to eliminate Peter Pan and Tinkerbelle, The Wolf(wolves) might have to remove Little Red Riding hood and the three pigs, etc... On the flip side, I know I have to eliminate a bad guy myself.. but like the clarification I asked of Render this morning, he stated eliminate can also mean vote off for 24 hours+ .. thats why I took my stance I did on Oliegirl. I found her action to be malicious and one that doesn't seem to match a "good" behavior for what I expect in this game from similar good characters like myself.

I think it is up to other good characters to try to "police" this behavior by punishing others who attack in this game rather than simply vote to the bog. If there are good characters that specifically have to kill and not eliminate someone, then please feel free to correct me, but this is a very key point that I asked Render that he clarified for me this morning. (as you can see in the thread).

So My vote is staying on Oliegirl for what I perceive as an "evil" attack, regardless of if she is good or bad.,

I think I'm leaning that way, anyone who does "evil" things, should be looked at, they certainly aren't helping me and my team win, so

Vote Oliegirl

Guys, I'm good...I knew I had a black potion but that was it. PB saw me last night, and then saw the wolf with red fabric, so you know I'm not the killer. I considered that the potion could be bad, but there were other possibilities as well...it could have been a truth potion, it could have been a conversion potion, it could have been a lot of things other than poison. I'm sorry it was poison, if I'd had that information I wouldn't have used it.

well PB do you want to confirm what Olie has said?

I think we have to be careful about the good guy/bad guy definition this game. There are the overall bad guys (the wolves, mice, evil mastermind), but there also seem to be good guys who might have a victory condition of taking out someone and make a wrong call.

Just checking in after waking up. I'll have to peruse the thread a bit later, as I have to pick up my daughter and eat lunch.

Why would someone with a tail want to kill Tinkerbelle? I don't get that.

Olie you can not be the killer of little red and still be bad.

I don't understand this sentence at all.

That's very interesting, because I also have to eliminate a bad guy, but it specifically says they need to be killed and just lynched doesn't count.

It took me about five readings before I got it. I THINK he's saying that she could be bad regardless of whether or not she killed Little Red Riding Hood. So even if she isn't the killer, that doesn't clear her.

Ok, I could be dense, but why are the mice bad?

Ditto.

I read the above to mean the mice were bad. I could be reading that totally wrong.

Are you man or mouse?

Sorry, couldn't resist :)

Sorry, I don't think I explained myself very well. What I mean is someone could say, "hey, cronin said DC has a tail! whoa, cronin's dead, DC must have killed him because he pointed her out, let's vote for her"... catch my drift?

I read that to mean they are a faction (like the pigs listed above are a faction) but not necessarily the uber-bad-one or an uber-bad-one that we need to eliminate

someone save telle!!!!

We should at least wait on OG until Telle dies, right?

I've seen villager kills where they've gotten a bad guy, and kills where they've gotten a good one. We should at least wait and see.

Well I'd personally prefer to live, if that's alright by you.

DT - are you allowed to comment?

Anxiety - I'm of the same opinion that you are on Oliegirl. I'm inclined to see how this plays out before throwing her under the bus. Of course, if someone does save Telle then we aren't going to be able to interpret Olie's actions.

For what it is worth, I thinking Olie's motivations are exactly what she says they were in the thread mainly because that is consistent with what I've seen of her play in previous games. No idea if she made a good decision or a bad one, but I'm unlikely to vote for her today.

Dola - not trying to be a jerk, DT. Just making sure I understand the rules for what happens when someone is moved to the bog.

He did in post 236...

Guys, I didn't kill Telle...she is "saveable"...I took a chance and it ended being a mistake, don't sit there and tell me that you guys haven't made mistakes in WW before.

I'm telling you, I'm not a bad guy.

sorry. i posted and i wasn't supposed to. *clamping my mouth shut*

And if we lynch you then you're technically still "saveable" too.. and without a 12 noon expiration date even.

Telle, can you give me a reason why I would want to use my potion (only know color) to try and save you rather than doing something else with it? Can you convince me that you are worth my taking a chance on you?

- can anyone vouch for you yet at this point in the game?
- is your role an important one for my personal victory conditions?
- is your role an important one for the overall success of the "village", whatever the heck that means this game?

Just throwing out a couple of areas where you could say something that would help me make a decision. I've held off on my second action for the day to allow time for this.

Hoops...who are you talking to here???

1. Not that I know of.
2. No idea.. I don't know your role or your personal victory conditions.
3. No idea.. my role PM didn't say anything about wolves or pigs or mice.

And quite honestly, I have no idea if your potion would cure me or finish me off. So I'd say save the potion until tomorrow and we'll see if there's anything to figure out after deadline comes.

Ok, so the wolves are the wolves? And everyone else are the villagers? Basically? (with the possible exception of a wolf-ally or two?)

Telle. Anyone else who feels like answering those questions can feel free to do so, but since I'm trying to figure out whether to attempt a save with my potion of unknown capabilities, I figure I might have a chance of getting answers from her to help me make a good call.

Olie - do you think that someone should try to save Telle at this point? If so, what has changed from when you used the potion on her initially?

basically.

How would the deadline results impact your poisoned condition? Also, I will almost certainly be passing my potion rather than holding onto it (now that I've announced it) so the decision tomorrow would rest with someone else.

If you would prefer I not use it today, that is fine and I'll stop considering it. But I didn't understand the reasoning about what tomorrow might bring as it relates to your health.

RendeR's quote also confirms that there are pigs in the game. Something that I did not know until now.

Well you or I may gain information as to whether we should have more or less trust for each other.. which could help you decide whether or not you want to help me and me decide whether or not I should accept that help. Someone may decide to kill me overnight, which would make the use of the potion a waste. Someone might actually find something labeled "antidote". Basically there's just more chance for all of us to have more info to go on.

I'd agree on the fact that you might as well use the potion tomorrow instead...

Ummm... st.cronin/Tinkerbell is dead.

Except for the fact that, as I noted earlier, I'll be giving someone else the opportunity to make that decision.

True, so pass it to someone you think is smart and good! ;)

RendeR, does the act of passing an item consume an action point?

I've already used on action today to determine if Mr. Wednesday is my ally (I've only got one ally, as far as I know). So I've got one left. Would I have to burn that action to pass my potion or would it be a zero point action (like moving) thus allowing me to search/spy/whatever?

I asked Render about this earlier regarding an item I found. he said that passing an item did not count as one of my two actions.

vote dodgerchick

I'm about to head home. I think if Telle dies and turns up good I'm sure there is someone out there that can eliminate O-girl for us and this allows Dodger to semi-remain in the game...I feel it's the most fair....well except for Telle who might die. :(

unvote oliegirl

vote dodgerchick

You may not be bad, i admit that, but there are bad people with a tail, so there is a chance.

Add into that the fact that the person I need to find doesn't have a tail, and you're the best option for me.

I just read everything. I have no idea who to vote for.

Well, I found out some information and I'm not sure what to think of it. But someone sure does stink... real bad. So bad my eyes watered for quite a while. Bad guy/girl? Or good guy/girl? Hmm... no way to find out 'til later. Can you guys think of any characters that leave a stench behind?

I'm going out for a while and will probably return by deadline.

If I have to decide between Dodgerchick (who may or may not have a tail) and Oliegirl (who actually poisoned someone) it's an easy decision.

VOTE OLIEGIRL

Very suspicious of DC voters.

Okay, I just re-read my PM and realized that this might not be the case and it has more to do with where I was... i swear... sometimes I need to think before I post. :mad:

First thought - oink, oink. Beyond that, I would have to take a look at the character list.

Cronin/Tinkerbelle stated she had a tail. Can you come up with a scenario where he would lie about this?

This happened to me just now as well when spying on someone.

shit, I just realized i won't be here for deadline

vote oliegirl

Self preservation vote obviously.

O don;t think DC is a bad guy because cronin turned up dead.

As a bad guy, I regularly look for opportunities to kill someone that will make people go after a villager. Killing cronin right after she slung at DC makes her look bad, ergo it is a good tactic to use.

On the other hamd, in this game, we have multiplae bad guys, so that strategy is not as useful and hte bad guys might mess up or be actiavelty hunting each other as well as us.

With that in mind, although nor,mally I would think this actually clears DC a tiny bit, I have to cinsider her a likely suspect.

I'd be happy to consider others if people would likew to propose alterantes, and I'm not even sure enought o vote yet, I'm just staing where I;m at right now.