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BishopMVP 07-31-2009 02:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstelmack (Post 2085448)
Bonds is the only one to break the home run record, but he's also generally a jerk who brought most of this upon himself. Mark McGwire and Roger Clemens did not come out of this exactly unscathed, however, so to claim Bonds gets particularly nasty treatment because of steroids isn't really true. The most that's come down on him because of that was scorn over the home run record.

As well as not being signed to a contract for the past 2 years, i.e. blackballed* and being prosecuted by the federal government?

*I still wish the Sox signed him now.
Quote:

Originally Posted by molson (Post 2085607)
So I guess he's not going to go the taking responsibility route.

He deserves the jeers he'll get on the road and the questions about the legitimacy of his career.

He came out with a (pretty legit) statement after the game
Quote:

Originally Posted by http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/2009/07/ortiz_statement.html
Today I was informed by a reporter that I was on the 2003 list of MLB players to test positive for performance-enhancing substances. This happened right before our game, and the news blindsided me. I said I had no comment because I wanted to get to the bottom of this.

I want to talk about this situation and I will as soon as I have more answers. In the meantime I want to let you know how I am approaching this situation. One, I have already contacted the Players Association to confirm if this report is true. I have just been told that the report is true. Based on the way I have lived my life, I am surprised to learn I tested positive. Two, I will find out what I tested positive for. And, three, based on whatever I learn, I will share this information with my club and the public. You know me - I will not hide and I will not make excuses.

I want to thank my family, the Red Sox, my teammates, and the fans for their patience and support.

Doesn't mean I believe him, but at least he's not ducking it. Please MLB, just release the whole list now instead of leaking 1-2 names every couple months so we can have the same discussion where the same people make the same exact points. Griffey, Pujols and Frank Thomas are the only 3 left who I think/hope were clean.
Quote:

Originally Posted by EagleFan (Post 2085618)
I love it when Yankees fans say this, as if they were actually around for all of them.

Year Two-thou-sand *clap clap clap-clap-clap*

stevew 07-31-2009 03:01 AM

"Oh shit...my bad, I didn't realize I was taking Winstrol, I thought it was Vitamin B-12"

Bitter Jets Fan 07-31-2009 03:42 AM

FINALLY Big Sh*tty got caught! :lol:

Easy Mac 07-31-2009 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BishopMVP (Post 2085894)
He came out with a (pretty legit) statement after the game

Really? That's a legit statement?

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 07:38 AM

The only thing about steroids and MLB testing that really concerns me is that you had some 100 or so players testing positive in 2003, then we're supposed to believe that testing was enacted and they've got a handful since then? That Manny was juicing in '03, juicing in '09, but clean in between? I'm not sure how clean the game is right now, to be honest. And that's not even considering the things that they aren't even able to test for because of legal or scientific constraints.

sterlingice 07-31-2009 07:53 AM

It's time to play: WHEEL... of... STEROID... (Apology)

Let's help him make up a generic steroid excuse. So, which will Big Papi use?

First he has to go one of two routes:
1) I didn't know it was a steroid
2) I only used it once (or for a short period)

It sounds like he's already dug in deep for response #1 with his "I didn't know and I'm surprised" act so that takes off the "I only took it for an injury" excuse.

That leaves us with quite a few options for his next part:
1) Must be a false positive
2) Don't know how it happened
3) A trainer told him it was vitamins
4) Another player/trainer/agent gave him the needle and he didn't ask questions
5) Got it from a cousin in the Dominican (we call this "The ARod")

So, does he
1) Apologize for us that we misunderstood him/his actions
2) Say he will never, ever do it again and feels bad for all the fans he "wronged"
3) Will find the perpetrator and eventually bring the one-armed man to justice

SI

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2085949)
The only thing about steroids and MLB testing that really concerns me is that you had some 100 or so players testing positive in 2003, then we're supposed to believe that testing was enacted and they've got a handful since then? That Manny was juicing in '03, juicing in '09, but clean in between? I'm not sure how clean the game is right now, to be honest. And that's not even considering the things that they aren't even able to test for because of legal or scientific constraints.


Well, I'm sure after the testing regime came down, players tried to find ways to get around it. Maybe they asked their buddies in the NFL how they've been able to do it all these years :D.

samifan24 07-31-2009 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sterlingice (Post 2085964)
It's time to play: WHEEL... of... STEROID... (Apology)

Let's help him make up a generic steroid excuse. So, which will Big Papi use?

First he has to go one of two routes:
1) I didn't know it was a steroid
2) I only used it once (or for a short period)

It sounds like he's already dug in deep for response #1 with his "I didn't know and I'm surprised" act so that takes off the "I only took it for an injury" excuse.

That leaves us with quite a few options for his next part:
1) Must be a false positive
2) Don't know how it happened
3) A trainer told him it was vitamins
4) Another player/trainer/agent gave him the needle and he didn't ask questions
5) Got it from a cousin in the Dominican (we call this "The ARod")

So, does he
1) Apologize for us that we misunderstood him/his actions
2) Say he will never, ever do it again and feels bad for all the fans he "wronged"
3) Will find the perpetrator and eventually bring the one-armed man to justice

SI


Sadly yes, this is what it has come down to each and every time we get a positive result. Big Papi talked tough about steroids this spring training. What will he say now that the public knows he was lying?

Oilers9911 07-31-2009 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevew (Post 2085616)
Aramis, Jason Schmidt....After that we're talking nobody since the early 90s who's even been good.

And now that Aramis makes the big bucks and has like 8 homers, he's probably not even a franchise guy anymore.


The 8 homers comment is a little off since Aramis missed a large part of the season.

RomaGoth 07-31-2009 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui (Post 2086033)
Well, I'm sure after the testing regime came down, players tried to find ways to get around it. Maybe they asked their buddies in the NFL how they've been able to do it all these years :D.


I find it interesting that the players KNEW they were going to be tested, and obviously 100+ dumbass players STILL had the cajones to take the stuff, knowing that they would test positive and possibly give the OK for MLB to perform random testing.

What a joke MLB is.

Oilers9911 07-31-2009 10:22 AM

As much as I hate the Red Sox, and Yankees I don't see how these revelations about who was caught juicing makes their titles tainted. If we saw the whole list I would guess that every team is represented. So their juicers were just better than everyone elses juicers. And Papi is no big surprise. He goes from 20 HRs to 54 in what, 4 seasons?

EagleFan 07-31-2009 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crapshoot (Post 2085839)
Suck it Charlie Manuel; suck it hard.


Sounds like someone forgot to take their Midol.

RomaGoth 07-31-2009 10:29 AM

I guess Bronson Arroyo is coming out now too...

Bronson Arroyo says he used andro, stopped due to rumors it was tainted with steroids - ESPN


My favorite line from this story:

Quote:

...The FDA wasn't regulating stuff, not unless it was killing people or people were dying from it.

Aren't these the same thing? :confused:

DeToxRox 07-31-2009 10:32 AM

Tigs got Washburn apparently. Not sure what for yet.

Lathum 07-31-2009 10:33 AM

I just want all of this to go away already.

DeToxRox 07-31-2009 10:38 AM

Dola, looks like the Tigs didn't give up anything of consequence. Lucas French and another prospect. The other prospect hasn't been confirmed as to who it is but the names I'm hearing aren't much of a blow.

RomaGoth 07-31-2009 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeToxRox (Post 2086082)
Dola, looks like the Tigs didn't give up anything of consequence. Lucas French and another prospect. The other prospect hasn't been confirmed as to who it is but the names I'm hearing aren't much of a blow.


I thought they needed more help in the bullpen and another bat. Why would they pick up another starter?

DeToxRox 07-31-2009 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RomaGoth (Post 2086089)
I thought they needed more help in the bullpen and another bat. Why would they pick up another starter?


We need everything. Our rotation right now is Verlander, Jackson, Porcello (Who is hitting the wall), Galarraga (Who you have no idea what he'll do any start) and a mix mash of guys at #5. I think Fien called up helps, and Bonderman will end up in the pen for some help.

For what we gave up, you can't pass up on Washburn, who has a similar situation in Detroit; big park and good D, plus he is a lefty we need in the rotation.

That said, we still have no offense and I suspect we won't win the Central without either Guillen (possibly) or Magglio (No chance) getting better, Polanco reverting back to form and another bat emerging.

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 10:59 AM

Jim Rice Inducted Into Baseball Hall Of Adequacy | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

:D

RomaGoth 07-31-2009 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeToxRox (Post 2086093)
We need everything. Our rotation right now is Verlander, Jackson, Porcello (Who is hitting the wall), Galarraga (Who you have no idea what he'll do any start) and a mix mash of guys at #5. I think Fien called up helps, and Bonderman will end up in the pen for some help.

For what we gave up, you can't pass up on Washburn, who has a similar situation in Detroit; big park and good D, plus he is a lefty we need in the rotation.

That said, we still have no offense and I suspect we won't win the Central without either Guillen (possibly) or Magglio (No chance) getting better, Polanco reverting back to form and another bat emerging.


I had heard rumors of a Freddy Sanchez to Detroit trade, but obviously that didn't happen. The Tigers need another bat, someone who can hit in the 4-7 spot, and take some of the pressure off Ordonez and Granderson. Not sure if anyone decent is available at this point though.

Also kinda surprised Seattle traded Washburn, aren't they still in the hunt for a playoff spot?

RomaGoth 07-31-2009 11:02 AM


:lol:

sterlingice 07-31-2009 11:11 AM


:)

SI

DaddyTorgo 07-31-2009 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oilers9911 (Post 2086069)
As much as I hate the Red Sox, and Yankees I don't see how these revelations about who was caught juicing makes their titles tainted. If we saw the whole list I would guess that every team is represented. So their juicers were just better than everyone elses juicers. And Papi is no big surprise. He goes from 20 HRs to 54 in what, 4 seasons?


i kinda agree.

as somebody else said "so one team of juicers beat another team of juicers."

it's not that that saddens me as much as it's the destruction of the long-term records for things due to players playing longer at higher levels.

now that we have a positive Papi-test I'm pissed that for instance he beat Foxx's Red Sox record for HR in a season. Not so much that he won 2 WS.

gstelmack 07-31-2009 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BishopMVP (Post 2085894)
As well as not being signed to a contract for the past 2 years, i.e. blackballed* and being prosecuted by the federal government?


Bonds was not a very good hitter at the time, plus he's a TO-like cancer. Why would anyone want to sign him?

And Boston had no chance with him since he thinks Boston is a racist city.

Logan 07-31-2009 11:57 AM

Off today so I have MLB Network on with their deadline coverage.

It's really not hurtful at all to see Jim Duquette on this fucking thing on this day of all days.

Mr. Sparkle 07-31-2009 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstelmack (Post 2086115)
Bonds was not a very good hitter at the time


Um...what?

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstelmack (Post 2086115)
Bonds was not a very good hitter at the time,


What? Bonds' last full season (2007), he hit .278/.480/.565 with an OPS+ of 170.

Crapshoot 07-31-2009 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gstelmack (Post 2086115)
Bonds was not a very good hitter at the time, plus he's a TO-like cancer. Why would anyone want to sign him?

And Boston had no chance with him since he thinks Boston is a racist city.


You're talking out of your ass - He had an OPS+ of 170 his last year, and the lead the league in OBP; again. He could still out-hit most of the Giants.

BishopMVP 07-31-2009 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Easy Mac (Post 2085914)
Really? That's a legit statement?

I'm not saying he's telling the truth, but compared to "I'm not here to talk about the past" and the 6 different excuses A-Rod used in 2 days, it's a pretty well worded press release. And I think he's already selected option A - going with "took a protein shake in the dominican, didn't ask what was in it."
Quote:

Originally Posted by RomaGoth (Post 2086105)
Also kinda surprised Seattle traded Washburn, aren't they still in the hunt for a playoff spot?

And didn't they also just trade prospects for Jack Wilson? What's going on there?
Quote:

Originally Posted by gstelmack (Post 2086115)
Bonds was not a very good hitter at the time, plus he's a TO-like cancer. Why would anyone want to sign him?

And Boston had no chance with him since he thinks Boston is a racist city.

When was he not a good hitter? He had OPS+of 156 and 170 his last 2 seasons. His OBP his last season was .480 and led the league by .046. Use one of the other excuses (my thoughts on chemistry in baseball are well documented here - I'll take Bonds, Manny and Adam Dunn as my 3/4/5 hitters any day if I can overcome their defensive liabilities) but please please don't try and tell me Barry Bonds couldn't step in the batters box and outperform at least 90% of major leaguers.

It's a moot point, but Kevin Garnett thought Boston was a racist city and so did Randy Moss. The media played up that angle the one time Bonds came in interleague and he was backtracking before he left town. I'm sure if he still wanted to play and Boston was the only team offering a contract he'd overcome any lingering doubts.

Arles 07-31-2009 12:52 PM

Think Papi still feels this way?

Quote:

"I would suggest everybody get tested, not random, everybody," he said. "You go team by team. You test everybody three, four times a year and that's about it."

And if a player tests positive for steroids?

"Ban 'em for the whole year," the slugger said.

The current penalties are a 50-game suspension for a player who tests positive once, 100 games for a second positive test for the same player and a lifetime ban for a third positive test, though a player can seek to return after two years.

Philadelphia Phillies pitcher J.C. Romero was suspended last month for the first 50 games this season after testing positive for a banned substance contained in an over-the-counter supplement.

On Sunday, Chicago White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen called for a one-year suspension for a positive steroids test.

"I think you clean up the game by the testing," Ortiz said Monday. "I know that if I test positive by using any kind of substance, I know that I'm going to disrespect my family, the game, the fans and everybody, and I don't want to be facing that situation.

"So what would I do? I won't use it, and I'm pretty sure that everybody is on the same page," he said.

Doh!

David Ortiz: Steroid users should get one-year suspension - ESPN

BishopMVP 07-31-2009 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logan (Post 2086146)
Off today so I have MLB Network on with their deadline coverage.

It's really not hurtful at all to see Jim Duquette on this fucking thing on this day of all days.

Duquette's worse than Steve Phillips?

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 12:58 PM

Bob Nightengale of USA Today says Red Sox are about to get VMart.

http://twitter.com/BNightengale

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 01:00 PM

Uh... yes.

Steve Phillips didn't fucking trade Kazmir for Zambrano!

molson 07-31-2009 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arles (Post 2086207)


He's clearly an idiot and a cheater, though everybody seems to be forgetting that there was no penalties or actual testing in 2003 (just the "anonymous" sample-testing).

What he's saying there isn't really inconsistent with his actions. In retrospect, it's actually kind of telling. He's basically saying that if there were testing and penalties, then that would motivate him and other players not to use. That wasn't the case in 2003, though it is now.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 01:07 PM

The worst part about Ortiz testing positive is not that he cheated, but that he lied about it. I wish he'd just kept his damn mouth shut. The cheating I can accept, but the lying just makes him a different person than I thought he was.

Mizzou B-ball fan 07-31-2009 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2086213)
Bob Nightengale of USA Today says Red Sox are about to get VMart.

http://twitter.com/BNightengale


So will he bitch at the Yankees the first time they blow out the Red Sox?

molson 07-31-2009 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan (Post 2086230)
So will he bitch at the Yankees the first time they blow out the Red Sox?


It's kind of annoying to maybe have to root for that goof, but I can get over it if this makes Varitek a backup.

I'm not as in love with Buchholz as most Red Sox fans, but even I'm not exciting about parting with him for Martinez. I don't think that makes them all that much better even this season.

molson 07-31-2009 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2086221)
The worst part about Ortiz testing positive is not that he cheated, but that he lied about it. I wish he'd just kept his damn mouth shut. The cheating I can accept, but the lying just makes him a different person than I thought he was.


Did he ever say he never used?

I can see someone using steroids while there's no policy for it, then when its banned, be in favor of significant penalties. That's totally consistent with what we hear about steroid use. They use it to be competitive. If they're not going to use it anymore because of a policy, they sure as hell don't want other people to use it either.

I'm not naive enough, though, to think that he's not still using, along with everyone else. Just playing with the logic of what he said here.

Big Fo 07-31-2009 01:26 PM

I'm tired of hearing about the 2003 tests, I wish whoever it is would release the whole list and get it over with. It was six years ago and baseball hadn't banned those substances yet. I would like to see the sport do better combating steroid usage going forward but move on from the past.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 01:28 PM

He pretty clearly said he didn't use on several occasions.

Hearing that Buchholz is going to CLE. Pretty disappointed if that's true. The only way it makes sense is if the FO thinks his makeup issues will persist and that he's at the top of his trade value now. Still, I think his value is higher than VMart.

samifan24 07-31-2009 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2086213)
Bob Nightengale of USA Today says Red Sox are about to get VMart.

http://twitter.com/BNightengale


No word yet on what the Indians would receive in return although Joel Sherman says he thinks it will be Buchholz.

molson 07-31-2009 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2086245)
Hearing that Buchholz is going to CLE. Pretty disappointed if that's true. The only way it makes sense is if the FO thinks his makeup issues will persist and that he's at the top of his trade value now. Still, I think his value is higher than VMart.


And thinking about it more and reading the sentiments at SOSH, there's no way that Varitek is just going to be benched or released. So Martinez is basically going to be a platoon player unless Lowell gets hurt again.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 01:32 PM

Now seeing everywhere that its not Buchholz. The first Twitter Trading Deadline is rife with potholes.

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 01:34 PM

If its not Buchholz, it makes me wonder if the deal is done, because that's been what Cleveland has been asking for, IIRC.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 01:36 PM

Now seeing its Hagadone. Guy had TJ surgery but has looked good in 25 IP since his return.

He does not qualify as anywhere near ML ready, though.

Edit: Masterson + Hagadone? Masterson would be the ML guy.

JPhillips 07-31-2009 01:36 PM

I just heard that Bucholz has been attacked by the Basij!

Sublime 2 07-31-2009 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2086259)
Now seeing its Hagadone. Guy had TJ surgery but has looked good in 25 IP since his return.

He does not qualify as anywhere near ML ready, though.

Edit: Masterson + Hagadone? Masterson would be the ML guy.


Bowden and Hagadone? Hopefully not Masterson/Bowden/Hagadone.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 01:40 PM

Can't see it being three like that. (Masterson or Bowden) + Hagadone is a pretty fair deal, though one I can be happy with.

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 01:44 PM

Rumor appears to be Masterson and Hagadone... and then the Sox to turn around and deal LaRoche (cause they would have no need for him with V-Mart) to the Mets.

Dr. Sak 07-31-2009 01:44 PM

LaRoche gets the shaft! Hah!

Mizzou B-ball fan 07-31-2009 01:46 PM

So tomorrow is Victor Martinez Bobblehead Doll Day????? Ohhhhhh, that's fantastic!

Bobblehead Daze » Blog Archive » Indians 2009 Bobblehead Days

Sublime 2 07-31-2009 01:50 PM

Now if we can convince Tito to actually sit Tek for V-Mart I'll be happy.

God I hope Cora isn't returning for the Laroche deal.

Karlifornia 07-31-2009 01:50 PM

Just another bullet point to add to the list of reasons Barry Bonds is an undeserving scapegoat.

RomaGoth 07-31-2009 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Sak (Post 2086268)
LaRoche gets the shaft! Hah!


Probably still happy he isn't a Pirate anymore though.

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sublime 2 (Post 2086273)
Now if we can convince Tito to actually sit Tek for V-Mart I'll be happy.

God I hope Cora isn't returning for the Laroche deal.


Considering that the Mets need Alex Cora because Reyes is hurt, they probably won't be sending him.

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 01:58 PM

Now there are rumors that the Dodgers are making a push to get Adrian Gonzales.

JonInMiddleGA 07-31-2009 02:01 PM

MINNEAPOLIS -- Shortstop Orlando Cabrera has been traded from the Oakland Athletics to the Minnesota Twins.

The Twins sent minor league infielder Tyler Ladendorf to the A's for Cabrera and cash. Friday's deal came a few hours before baseball's 4 p.m. ET non-waiver trade deadline.

Minnesota entered the day two games behind Detroit in the AL Central. The Twins need more production up the middle, with Nick Punto and Alexi Casilla struggling to hit this season.

Leading Twins players have also recently expressed their desire to see the team make a move to upgrade the roster. The Twins have traditionally been quiet at the deadline.

Cabrera was batting .280 with four homers, 41 RBIs and 11 steals for Oakland. He was expected to be at the Metrodome for Saturday's game against the Angels.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui (Post 2086282)
Now there are rumors that the Dodgers are making a push to get Adrian Gonzales.


Please don't trade Kemp. I need him to win my fantasy league.

Atocep 07-31-2009 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui (Post 2086282)
Now there are rumors that the Dodgers are making a push to get Adrian Gonzales.



I would really like to hear what the dodgers are offering. They have some talent in the upper levels, but no elite prospects there. They'd have to part with one their young major leaguers, you'd think.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 02:08 PM

Well, you would probably start with Loney, right?

RomaGoth 07-31-2009 02:10 PM

The Padres appear to be attempting a "Pirates of the West Coast" routine....do they have any other players they would like to dump in order to "rebuild"?

(I quoted because I believe in order to rebuild, you probably should have won something, then got old/lost good players/etc., restocked system to, ahem, rebuild)

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 02:11 PM

Yeah, you'd imagine that Loney would have to be there. They probably wouldn't want to deal Kemp or Ethier, but you'd imagine the Padres would be asking about one of them instead of Loney.

JonInMiddleGA 07-31-2009 02:11 PM

MILWAUKEE -- The Milwaukee Brewers reacquired reliever Claudio Vargas from the Los Angeles Dodgers on Friday.

The Dodgers got minor league catcher Vinny Rottino in the trade Friday between playoff contenders. The deal was completed hours before baseball's non-waiver 4 p.m. ET deadline.

sterlingice 07-31-2009 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mizzou B-ball fan (Post 2086269)
So tomorrow is Victor Martinez Bobblehead Doll Day?????


Whoops

SI

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 02:16 PM

LaRoche to the Braves is what I'm seeing.

molson 07-31-2009 02:20 PM

So is San Diego a "small market" (and thus worthy of our pity), when they rank higher than St. Louis, Atlanta, Denver, and Baltimore in market size?

Of course, this is a league where Boston is generally considered the 2nd largest market in the country, so anything's possible.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 02:22 PM

LaRoche for Kotchman? Does he have options still?

Galaril 07-31-2009 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2086307)
LaRoche for Kotchman? Does he have options still?


This is starting to smell like the Sox trying to get a player the Blue Jays want in order to trade Halladay. That would be huge get both Victor AND Halladay:)

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 02:25 PM

I thought the same thing, but it begs the question.... why would the Blue Jays want Kotchman?

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 02:28 PM

I'm doubting a package for Halladay can be hammered out in the half hour we have left.

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 02:30 PM

So apparently the V-Mart deal also includedBryan Price being sent by the Sox to the Tribe as well. So, Masterson, Hagadone, and Price for V-Mart.

Logan 07-31-2009 02:49 PM

Guy behind the MLBTrades Twitter saying Adrian Gonzalez AND Bell could be going to the Dodgers?

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 02:49 PM

Did Scott Rolen really just get traded to the Reds (if he waives his no-trade)? And if so, why?

stevew 07-31-2009 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui (Post 2086311)
I'm doubting a package for Halladay can be hammered out in the half hour we have left.


Still wouldn't be super suprised to see Philly change their minds, regardless of what they've done.

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logan (Post 2086332)
Guy behind the MLBTrades Twitter saying Adrian Gonzalez AND Bell could be going to the Dodgers?


Dodgers did just acquire Sherrill... that makes some relief easier to deal.

JPhillips 07-31-2009 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ISiddiqui (Post 2086333)
Did Scott Rolen really just get traded to the Reds (if he waives his no-trade)? And if so, why?


God I hope not. Jocketty has a man crush though. I really hope the rumors of Yonder Alonso being a part of this aren't true.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 03:01 PM

I just read somehwere EE and Alonso. That can't be right.

JPhillips 07-31-2009 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2086344)
I just read somehwere EE and Alonso. That can't be right.


That's what it seems to be. Alonso can't be traded until after Aug. 15, so watch out if it's a PTBNL. Nice haul for a 34 year old.

If one of our Cincy contingent can punch Walt in the throat for this I'd appreciate it.

Atocep 07-31-2009 03:15 PM

For Rolen? Really Walt? Really?

sterlingice 07-31-2009 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2086344)
I just read somehwere EE and Alonso. That can't be right.


Keith Law is reporting this isn't true

SI

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 03:23 PM

Quote:

RT @johnfayman: #Reds sending Encarnacion, Roenicke, ZStewart to Toronto. Got C Chase Weems for Hairston.

Don't know anything about the Reds farm system.

Ronnie Dobbs2 07-31-2009 03:24 PM

Heyman saying Peavy to White Sox.

JPhillips 07-31-2009 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie Dobbs2 (Post 2086361)
Don't know anything about the Reds farm system.


That's a little better, but Stewart has good potential. I would have thought EE and Roenicke would have been enough given Rolen's age. Maybe the Jays are paying Rolen's salary.

Logan 07-31-2009 03:28 PM

Do they think he'll allow the deal now just because he's hurt?

Atocep 07-31-2009 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPhillips (Post 2086365)
That's a little better, but Stewart has good potential. I would have thought EE and Roenicke would have been enough given Rolen's age. Maybe the Jays are paying Rolen's salary.


Yeah, Roenicke and Stewart are both arms with some potential, but not likely to be players you're kicking yourself over losing 3-4 years from now.

I do question what the hell the Reds are doing, though, by adding a 34yo 3rd baseman with a history of injury problems when you're 9.5 games out of 1st.

JonInMiddleGA 07-31-2009 03:33 PM

You have got to be fucking shitting me. Frank Wren ought to be took out back and shot until the gun is empty. And then we need to reload & empty another clip in the dumb bastard.

LaRoche was dumped out of Atlanta in the first place because he was an inconsistent head case (yeah, I know, it's a mental health issue but still). And he's got a virtually identical OPS to Kotchman who at least tries hard, whereas LaRoche is capable of making Greg Norton look like a hitter & Garret Anderson look energetic.

Fuck me running.

stevew 07-31-2009 03:37 PM

lol-

Welcome to my last 2 summers Jon.

For a week, you'll see Albert Pujols. Then for a month he'll hit like a girl.

k0ruptr 07-31-2009 03:38 PM

Great, now we have a injured Jake Peavy. and we gave up Poreda . FUCK. OMG, and Richard? and Adam Russel! WTF are the Chisox thinking. thats retarded. FML

k0ruptr 07-31-2009 03:39 PM

Dola, I swear I REALLY hope we kept at least Richard, or Poreda. if not I'm going to throw something really fucking hard at the wall.

ISiddiqui 07-31-2009 03:39 PM

Injured Peavy helps morale! ;)

JonInMiddleGA 07-31-2009 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevew (Post 2086374)
lol-Welcome to my last 2 summers Jon. For a week, you'll see Albert Pujols. Then for a month he'll hit like a girl.


There's more reason to bring his brother on board than there is this waste of fucking space.

Honest to God, I cannot remember the last time I truly despised a trade as much as I hate this one. Hell, I can't even come close to thinking of an example at the moment.

This absolutely f'nlutely settles the issue of whether Wren is overmatched in his job or not. This is an Isiah Thomas worthy deal and it'll be the death knell for the Braves flickering wildcard hopes. And once he has another of his patented ADD moments either in the field or on the bases, the fans will boo his ass to death just like they did leading up to his being shipped out in the first place.

k0ruptr 07-31-2009 03:41 PM

apparently its fucking Adam Russell, Aaron Poreda, Clayton Richard, and Dexter Carter. We just got ripped off like nothing else.

All for Jake "torn up ankle" Peavy

stevew 07-31-2009 03:42 PM

His brother is quickly turning into a useless cuntrag too. I need more than 4 homers and a .702 ops out of my every day 3b.

k0ruptr 07-31-2009 03:44 PM

oh, yea Peavy approved it seems. fuck my life

k0ruptr 07-31-2009 03:45 PM

Dola, honestly tho, if SOMEHOW he can come back and be Jake Peavy, then ok maybe I'll be somewhat happy. But losing 2 MLB ready starters (decent enough guys too) Dexter Carter (who looked promising to me) and Adam Russell just hurts.

The worst part about this deal is probably that Bartolo Colon and Contreras remain in the Rotation

yacovfb 07-31-2009 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by k0ruptr (Post 2086386)
oh, yea Peavy approved it seems. fuck my life


As a Padres fan, I have the same exact sentiment. He was my favorite player:banghead: :banghead:

RomaGoth 07-31-2009 03:50 PM

:popcorn:

k0ruptr 07-31-2009 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yacovfb (Post 2086388)
As a Padres fan, I have the same exact sentiment. He was my favorite player:banghead: :banghead:


you guys are getting a load in return. I really really like Peavy, I'm just worried because his ankle is tore up, and hes out for another month. But maybe it works out.

k0ruptr 07-31-2009 03:55 PM

Ok he is signed through 2012 with an option for 2013. that makes me feel a little better, I wasn't sure on that.

Big Fo 07-31-2009 03:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JonInMiddleGA (Post 2086380)
There's more reason to bring his brother on board than there is this waste of fucking space.

Honest to God, I cannot remember the last time I truly despised a trade as much as I hate this one. Hell, I can't even come close to thinking of an example at the moment.

This absolutely f'nlutely settles the issue of whether Wren is overmatched in his job or not. This is an Isiah Thomas worthy deal and it'll be the death knell for the Braves flickering wildcard hopes. And once he has another of his patented ADD moments either in the field or on the bases, the fans will boo his ass to death just like they did leading up to his being shipped out in the first place.


And if LaRoche manages to wildly exceed expectations in the next two months he's a free agent at the end of the year. Kotchman, while not particularly good, had 2.5 years left before free agency. Freedie Freeman better be ready soon. I don't understand this trade either.


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