Yeah. It's a delicate line they walk and so far they have done very well. They have moved things forward quite a bit, but have also opened up quite a few mysteries and questions as well.

Speaking of which, I have now watched the frist three(?) episodes of "Invasion." I think I'm out. The show isn't doing anything for me, especially when you compare it to "Lost." Lost goes by in what feels like 5 minutes and Invasion just drags and drags...

I think I watched the first 10 minutes of the Invasion premiere and lost interest (no pun intended) and never watched it again.

Just found this over on aintitcoolnews.com. Supports some theories thrown around here.

My fellow "Lost" addicts have an ongoing debate each week about practically every issue on the show and a couple of them thought the driver "killed" by Jack's future wife (Julie Bowen) in the season premiere flashback might have been Locke. Like, maybe he was revived later and that would explain his paralysis. So I reviewed the episode on tape and they're wrong: The other driver is Shannon's dad. The EMS guy who wheels him in says the patient is "Adam Rutherford, 57 ..." Well, if you check the official Web sites, Shannon's last name is Rutherford. And remember, one of her problems is that after her dad died, her stepmom (Boone's actual mother) cut her off financially. So, depending on how you look at it, either Jack's wife killed him in the accident, or Jack killed him by choosing to treat the girl instead. Dun-dun-DUNNNNNN!

I also hope that the show doesn't end up that its just some experimental island or some sort of "occoms razor" type explanation.

There's a definate coolness to the show they've achieved. Don't f*ck it up Abrams.

I thought last nights episode was top notch.

The thing is, even if it is something stupid such as that, I'd still be happy just because of what the show has done to me. It makes me think like no other show. I don't suspect that it will be something like that; besides I wouldn't be surprised if we were a few seasons off from 'the end'.

I don't think it will. I think, based on what we've seen, that some part of it all will be that the island was some sort of "experimental island" set up by psychologists (who are from THE UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN, BABY!!!!) to studay various phenomenon (as explained in the film). But I also think there are likely to be "forces of unknown" origin that existed on the island prior to the experiments. I certaintly don't think there will be an "occom's razor" explanation.

Just hope its not one big dream by Hurley.

You know, I think that no matter what they ultimately do for an ending when all the secrets are revealed, there's a pretty big chance that a large number of people will be unsatisfied with it. People will either think it was too obvious or too wacky. By the time the show runs its course, every possibility will have likely been mentioned.

Don't get me wrong; I love the show. And I'm in for the entire ride. I just think that people looking for something profound and/or wholly original when it ends are going to be sorely disappointed.

I said from day 1 that it would be impossible to come up with a universally satisfactory ending...no matter what they come up with.

Love the show though, in for the duration.

One of the writers confirmed this a while back that it was Shannon's father. The fact that the writer actually revealed something makes me think it wasn't too important ... just another indication that everyone one the island is somehow linked.

On another note, I still think there's a reason the mystery Dharma benefactor was fuzzy in the movie. If it's not Locke's dad, it's got to be someone we've seen and/or will be seeing soon.

I don't know that it's Locke's dad, but I am harboring a certain suspicion that Locke's dad is the con-man who Sawyer's been looking for.

Ohh, that's a good one.

Another interesting speculation post....not spoilers...just speculation based upon what we already know from the most recent episode.


We know that the 'hatch' is station #3 and has something to do with electromagnetism.. We also, through the video hear the narrator say that they are conducting studies in...

"meteorology, psychology, para-psychology, zoology, electro-magnetism, and utopian social ."

then you can go to the Hanso Foundation website and see that they are also involved in..

Life-Extension Project, Electromagnetic Research Initiative,
Quest for Extra-Terrestrial Intelligence,The Hanso Mathematical Forecasting Initiative, The Hanso Cryogenics Development Imperative, The Hanso Juxtapositional Eugenics Development Institute, The Hanso Accelerated Remote Viewing Training Facility

I believe now that there is one station (or hatch) on the island for each of the main projects (the video says 3 of 6 so lets assume there are 6 projects). I think that the Zoology experimenters created the polar bears and the shark. I think that the whispering voices we hear in the woods are people involved in the Remote Viewing project (parapsychology), and I think that someone forgot to enter the numbers in the Swan station (electromagnetism) about 44 days ago causing the plane to crash.

I think that we will see every single person in that video here on the island (or at least the DeGrotes and the lead scientist). I wouldnt be surprised if THEY were in fact the Others.

The creators of this show have just kind of written themselves a blank check as far as the number of directions they can take the show (and the island).

I must have missed something, what's the Hanso Foundation and what does it have to do with anything?

Alvar Hanso is that Blurry guy they showed in the shadows during that film, the head guy of the Dharma Corporation I think.

EDIT: See post #176

Damn! I was hoping to toss out that tid-bit today, but you beat me to it. As soon as the Father said that Locke wasn't the first person to be conned, I went straight to Sawyer. Of course....on the downside, I'm usually too obtuse to notice subtle hints of this type. So that means I've probably ascribed too much meaning to it. Probably nothing.

Someone on totalfark posted this picture.

I thought it was an interesting idea.

Maybe??? Good Catch. Wonder if the other guy across from the blond in the video is the bearded guy? So would that make the "Others" the original scientists that started these labs and everyone else has crashed there since them.

The Scientists went crazy.

French Ladies ship and crew crashed there because of Electro Magnetics.

Her crew went crazy from the voices and experiments.

Drug plane crashed because of the Electro Magnetics as well as Oceanic Flight 815.

Question is, if Electro Magnetics plays such a huge role, I would think that in this day and age governments can somehow see a large Electro-Magnetic disturbance there.

EDIT:OOPS, forget first part didnt scroll over to the right in the picture.

Nice, but why would they want Walt?

Ok, I just watched last night's episode... and here are my thoughts:

- After looking at the picture of Hanso & Locke's father about 50 times... it has to be either the same person, or someone we've never seen before. They look way to much alike.

- I tend to agree with gottimd's theory about the different scientific labs... it would explain alot. See next point regarding the boat people...

- Ana's "others" I don't believe are infected by anything... I think they think that the original survivors are the "evil" others. It's more likly the boat people are infected with something... why would they be so hostile, if they were just scientists?

- Jin's scene where he speaks english is either a backstory segment, or in the hatch... which would then lead me to believe that he has something to do with the project. The scientist on the film was Asian, wasn't he. I know I'm being simplistic with that, but who knows...

I wonder, since Hanso seemed to be big into the medical fields, if in a future backstory there isn't some connection between Jack and/or his father with the guy. But then why didn't jack recognize him or his name?


I am going with Jin speaking english as a dream sequence. I just don't see how that could fit in anywhere. Like when it looked like Locke was shot last season.

Maybe those others need Walt for some genetic studies??? They need a young person to test long term effects? Who knows, maybe that is why Ethan was going after the baby?

More importantly, I wonder what Sov will change the title to each week?

By dream sequence do you mean backstory? Because it seems, from the preview, that there is alot of Hurley in next weeks episode... which leads me to believe next week is his turn.

No, Dream Sequence. There maybe a portion of the show, for instance next week, that his wife is having a dream of what has happened to Jin, and she is picturing him saying that, speaking in perfect english.

It is a hurley centered episode I believe.

Regarding Jin, I coulda sworn in season one he tipped it off that he could speak English through one of his backstories. Gotta pull out my DVD's for season 1.

One thing that kind of bugs me is the loose attachment of the backstories to the current stories now though. Locke's "leap of faith" story with the leap of faith pressing the button to me seemed like just an excuse to show more of his story. While in the past, the backstories were kind of like what the character was thinking about at the particular time, I didn't think the whole Locke story in this episode had quite a direct relationship to what was probably going on in his mind in quarantine room.

They're kicking ass in the ratings. Too bad that the cast members are getting discouraged about the relative lack of attention they're getting though. Guess it's because they're looked at as sweaty and stinky unlike the sexual image of the housewives...

http://imdb.com/news/wenn/2005-10-06/#3

Because the kid has super powers!

BTW... has anyone done a google search on the book that the film was behind? There was a movie losely based on it... and it has an interesting title. I'll let you guys figure it out... :)

I was getting annoyed with this as well... I've never seen an interview with anyone on the show besides Fox or Meriadoc Brandybuck. While the cast of Housewives are on TV like every two seconds...

Double Dola,

Does anyone have a screen capture of the picture Desmond had in the hatch that Jack was looking at? My video of that screen is extremly dark...

Here you go.

Not exactly what I was looking for...

Not sure what you are referring to? What picture?

This is the best i've found

ah okay, now I remember. Did he look at the picture because maybe its somewhere in LA he recognized, and he was thinking he knew desmond from somewhere?

Yeah! And that's why Desmond seemed so set back when told they plane crashed 44 days ago. :) "44 days?"

Well he could just be shocked that they have survived up there for 44 days without a virus killing them, but you could be correct as well.

So Desmond should be losing his mind if he has had to reset that thing every 108 minutes. So he hasn't slept for more than 1 hour and 48 minutes at a time for god knows how long. If that was me, and I was down there by myself, I wouldve moved my bed ALOT closer to that thing so I could just roll over and type the numbers in and fall asleep. Or just figure out some system that would hen peck the numbers itself.

Not to mention no sex.

Dola, or beer

I was pleased they worked the Commodore Vic-20 into the show.

He had porn stored on the Vic 20. Every 87 minutes he gets busy.

Ah, then I would hope that he keeps the lotion close by as well.

that's why he was so pissed that someone opened the hatch. it was minute 79.

The reason I think that portion may just be a social experiment is because even those computers could be programmed to run those #'s. Why else would they have to be entered so frequently?

Like a Pavlov experiment?

Turn of the Screw by Henry James. It scared the bejesus outta me when I read it in High School.

As for the movie based on it. I've heard that "the Others" was loosely based on Turn of the Screw, but as I haven't seen the movie I can't be possitive. The name of the movie is definately food for thought.

To give them a break from jerking off? Anything over 108 minutes and you definitely need a break.

You are correct, the movie was "The Others."

I don't think it means anything it's just something the writers put in for the diehards to check out.

People are finding things all over these new sites that popped up. The training video that was shown in orientation is apparently up, and it is a lot clearer than what they showed on TV last night, but no additional stuff.

I cant get it to work.

I haven't finished reading this thread yet, but I was under the impression that Sawyer's con-man was the guy who sent him to Australia to kill the vender.

better screenshot of what Jack was looking at

That is what I mentioned in my post #181. Also, why didn't they show where the exit to the hatch leads? I'm just curious because if there is a "door" why didn't they find it before?

Now... who's the girl? :)

Is it Jack's wife?

Looks like it to me.

Jack's wife died right? If not, did she leave him for Desmond.

Eh.. i think i'm gonna have to say "inconclusive."

That was my presumption too, until the bit in the car with Locke's dad...seems like it could line up pretty well.

When Desmond decided he was going to run out of the hatch, he made a break to grab a bunch of the vials. When he did, they showed a quick shot of a book called The Third Policeman.

checking Amazon.com, here is their description of the book.


Fiction. The last of O'Brien's novels to be published and now reissued by Dalkey Archive, THE THIRD POLICEMAN is Flann O'Brien's brilliant comic novel about the nature of time, death, and existence. Told by a narrator who has committed a botche d robbery and brutal murder, the novel follows him and his adventures in a two-dimensional police station where he is intruduced to "Atomic Theory" and its relation to bicycles, the existence of eternity (which turns out to be just down the road), and the view that the earth is not round but "sausage-shaped."

parapsychology patient perhaps? we know he has certain "abilities".

That's what I've assumed as well.

Okay...then if this is true (and it seems very likely it is), then how would the French woman know the Others would want him? Could her son have had the same powers and that's why he was taken? If so, then how would the Others know that since (I believe) he was taken when he was a baby.

The orientation film shown in the last episode can be viewed here.

http://www.thehansofoundation.org/videostream.swf

OK, so combining speculations: There are 6 projects on the island all funded (or one time funded) by presumably Locke's dad, who is also the guy that Sawyer has been searching for. (the Dharma swan symbol is surrounded by an octagon which suggests 8, but the film clue clearly says 6). Let's assume it is Locke's dad and he is somewhere on the island.

The Electromagnetic Research Initiative is likely what brought Frenchy's boat to the island (assuming they didn't come there intentionally) and likely brought the plane down. Now did Desmond sleep through the entering the code which brought the plane down or did he not enter it on purpose (or under direction of say Locke's dad?).

We know some mishap occured on the island w/ all the experiments. We also know in season 1, Locke "saw" the secret of the island when he was attacked by the monster. Perhaps what he saw or heard was his father, who gave him some directions. This is why Locke is always saying to no one apparent "what am I supposed to do", and "this isn't the way it's supposed to happen". Perhaps even his father somehow knew he was on the plane and made Desmond bring the plane down so that he could have his son save the island. ???

The polar bears, etc.. are explained by the other experiments. The Others (non-plane survivors) are scientists who survived the mishap whatever it was. One group took the boy for his telekinetic (sp?) powers either to continue their experiments, to save them, or perhaps to push the "mental" button over and over just like Desmond had to do for the electromagnetic one. We also know/think that there are some crazy others, perhaps a virus at one point affected some of the scientists, explaining the quarrantine warning.

I want to say someone once said there was plans for a 6 or 8 season story arc. Perhaps what we'll get is the revelation of one project/hatch per season and the implications carried out throughout the season.

Then there is always the possibility that the big black guy is from the Nigerian drug plane...

Or Roses husband.

I was thinking that also. Wasn't he in the restroom in the back of the plane when it broke apart?

Well that doesn't look like LA.

Yup, which is exactly why I think it is him. I mean I am not discounting that he could be apart of the Nigerian Drug plane, and he befriended the tail survivors. But that drug plane, I am not sure how long it had been there. It seemed like it had been there a long time as the body of the priest Locke and Boone found found in the forest seemed pretty badly decomposed.

You're right it was Australia. Or maybe I meant "Lower Australia", yeah, thats the ticket!

It doesn't look like Julie Bowen to me.

Please sex Julie Bowen up a bit.

Thank you.

ok, just had a silly notion, humor me for a bit here cuz it *might* have legs:

just like how i speculated that Walt was needed perhaps for parapsychology purposes/testing, do you think the other main Lost characters have qualities that would fit them in the specific fields of science that were listed in the Dharma orientation film, which is why they're all there with a reason? we know, for arguement sake, that Walk already fits into the parapsychology category - do the other main cast members exemplify traits that match up with those fields? or is this looking way too much into something that might not be there.

I think the black guy from the other group spoke with an accent. Just judging by the way he swung that stick I would say he is Dominican.

I think the video said that the industrialist was Dutch or Belgian or something. Which would seem to make Locke's father a less likely candidate, but if they end up saying that Hanso went to evil medical school...

The "Swan" seems to be only asssociated with expirement number 3. So I am now wondering if the shark's emblem actaully had a swan on it or another symbol inside. You wouldn't think that zooology and electromagnetics would be part of the same station (the swan station.)

I think that the 'Black Rock" was pre-1970's, so I think we will find that the island has secrects besides what is going on with the Dharma Initiative.

with that arsenal of guns and the island security system at their disposal, the crash survivors should be able to show the "Others" and the other crash survivors who is in chrage on the island.

I was not aware Dominicans have a "Swing Stick" distinction quality about them. Plus why can't Roses husband be from another country?

I also do not believe Hanso is lockes father. he actually looks like cigarette smoking guy from the X-files.

Yes, the black rock looked like a pirate ship.

Heh, he swung his stick like a Dominician.

They are rumored to be baseball fanatics.

I read elsewhere that someone freeze-framed the shark picture and there was no swan on the emblem.

Someone posted the shark freezeframe in post #99 here. Doesn't look like a swan in the middle (although it's hard to tell) but definitely the same octagon image surrounding it.

I want to say on the film that they mentioned that the island had something peculiar which is why they setup the research facility there (so there is something innate about the island separate from the research which might explain the Black Rock ... then again it could be a random shipwreck in the middle of an island??).

That's exactly what I thought!

Yes I've seen that freeze frame and I don't remember there being a swan on it.



Looks like something else.

Could this just be a 'reason' as to why bad things happen over the Bermuda Triangle? Could this be an island within it? Is it possible geographically?

Not if they were flying from Australia to LA. Either that or they were WAY off target (like over the wrong ocean).

I believe the writers have already stated this is not the case.

I'm in this boat as well. I don't think Locke's father is Hanso or the "con-man".

I think Pedro Cerrano is Rose's husband.

Watching the episode again last night it is hard to miss the amount of weapons that they now have and should easily be able to wipe out the captors of Sawyer, Michael and Jin.

I actually think the people who took Walt are the "infected" others... I think they'd have a pretty hard time explaining how they knew of Walt's powers beforehand.

I wonder if Jack’s dad is alive. Did the island bring him back the same way Lock is no longer paralyzed?

Was the reason the plane crashed because of Jack’s father? Did the others, or scientists need him for something.

Did Jack’s father possibly have something to do with this Dharma project?

Did Jack’s father or Dharma somehow have something to do with Jack’s future wife’s recovery?

1. I doubt his father is alive.

2. They wouldn't need a dead doctor.

3. Yes, there probably is a connection

4. I doubt it they had anything to do with the recovery.

Jack's father's body is missing, though. Remember the episode last season, where they found his coffin, but not body.

The secret hatches would explain Jack's father disappearing after Jacked chased him into the jungle in the first season.

SWEET, I MADE THE THREAD TITLE.

Wouldn't him seeing his father just be a figment of his imagination?

I REALLY hope he's a zombie and eats Jack's brains.

MORE ZOMBIES, LESS JACK!!!!!!!!

Now THAT'S wha this show needs!!! Thanks bro. :)

Well yes it could, and that's likely what it was... but if his dad is alive, and on the island... it raises the possibility, however unlikely, that it was not his imagination.

i can't stand Jack. at first he was cool, he was the leader reluctantly given his authority. now he's bossing people around, carrying a gun and pointing it at someone every episode. he's let his leadership role go to his head. if i were on that island i would take it upon myself to eliminate him.

I just think his father is shown to see how the character of Jack reacts and how he became who he is. I don't think his father plays any more of a role than just maybe a connector between other stories, and that he is not involved with the island or alive on it either.

Dola,

Also I think the stories between the main characters are too intertwined to be chance. I think that at the end of the series, we'll find that the main characters are actually one person.

To be realistic, it would be too difficult to ensure that all of these interrelated characters are all on the same plane that crashes.

Identity, anyone?