Yeah, the Achilles' heel of this decade's Phillies teams have been the starting rotation. This is why we reached on guys like Adam Eaton and Freddy Garcia. Cole is the only "legitimate" starter we really have, although I have high hopes for Happ.

The real reason we won last year is because we had a team built to hit on our ballpark and a solid bullpen. Also, our defense is pretty underrated, but even that has hit the shits lately.

But not even the craziest Philly fan can tell you that our starting rotation is or even was legit before the season started or even during last year's post season. Cole just pulled it together at the right time, Blanton got hot at the right time, and Myers/Moyer were just plain lucky.

I still think the Marlins are going to win the division, to tell you the truth.

Florida always seems to play really well in July and August.

Can't wait to see Bumgarner and Alderson.

Also glad that Schierholtz is finally getting a chance to play everyday and he seems to be making the most of it.

Okay, so now I'm hearing the Braves might package Escobar and Vazquez in a deal. Who could we get that would make that worthwhile?

Vazquez being included would make me think it would have to be to another contender, or with a third party involved.

Been reading Buster Olney have we? ;)

Would have to be something earthshaking (to the Braves) I'd think, unless they're simply going to tank the season.

Here's a wild idea: Vazquez & Escobar to Washington for Nick Johnson & Adam Dunn, with Kotchman & Francouer going somewhere else in return for prospect that cycle through to Washington from that third team? Yeah, I'm just making shit up now.

Boston is the most likely place, but I don't see them letting Bay go (if they've theoretically given up on signing him next year) for even both of those guys no matter how much they may like Escobar. And an Ellsbury/Lugo (plus cash) package doesn't seem like enough to make it work. Only way I could figure is that Boston brings a third team into the deal to put more outfield help than they can provide.

Meanwhile, the Braves blow a great performance from Hanson.

I can't believe FOX is cutting away from their broadcast game to show Manny's ABs. Get suspended for PEDs? We'll show everyone your ABs! That's deterence!

They are certainly desperate. SI's Jon Heyman tweeted that the Phillies offered the Yankees a propect for Chien Mien Wang. The prospect wasn't good enough for the Yankees apparently. Wang was pitching well today until the 6th inning where he left the game with shoulder strain so that probably puts the end to the Wang trade rumors.

Chisox go down :( good streak, time to start a new one!

Did Fox really cut out of Mets-Phils to show the at bats of a guy coming off a fucking steroid suspension?

I mean, I know it was Mets-Phils, but still...

Lemme see here biggest name on the team with the best record in baseball vs teams that are a combined 2 games over .500 and are 7-13 between them in the last 10 games each.

Yeah, I'd have cut away too.

Lincecum has been lights out as of late. Hopefully he gets the nod to start the all-star game.

Sorry, but the audience who would be watching the Phils-Mets game on television (Saturday afternoon @ 4:00 = mainly those who follow the team and not the casual fan) does not give two shits about Manny either which way.

This ain't the Super Bowl. The Phils-Mets game was only available in the Northeastern market and if people were really focused on what Manny was going to do, they could watch it on teh internets.

I don't buy that argument at all, not even close. If the game was the northeast feed, you've got Boston in there & we both know damned well they're curious. And then there's the reality that we're talking about the most recognizable player in the game today not playing for the Yankees.

I hate to be so blunt about it (okay, not much, but still) Manny taking a dump or even trying to take a dump & failing is as of as much interest to people nationally than the Mets vs the Phils right now. Or for that matter any pairing of teams not named Yankees or Red Sox.

He's coming back from a suspension, not from getting shot. Nor was he hitting for some kind of record. Nothing at all made that at bat special.

You really think people were watching that game for the sole purpose of hoping that Fox would cut away to show his at bats?

Team with the second best record in the NL only gets two players into the All-Star Game.

How Sandoval doesn't get in especially when comparing his stats to Wright is questionable. Yea yea I know Wright was voted in, but still.

I think those AB's are of greater general interest than the game they were showing.

So, Jon, the Braves are desperate for anything resembling a moderately competent OF; the Giants would love a 2b. In a swap of things that teams don't want but are better than their options, what say you on a Fred Lewis for Kelly Johnson swap?

Lewis would only have the 4th best OPS among current Braves OF. And Kelly is on the DL anyways.

How about we send you Johnson & you just send over a couple of bags of batting practice balls & a half a bucket of sunflower seeds?

Yeah, but it's better than Francouer's, who's the starter (for inexplicable reasons).

Well, I'm hoping that Cox comes to his senses and puts Diaz in right.

LOL... Cox coming to his senses on Francouer? ;)

Deal. Good talking with you. And if Cox gets sick of Escobar, we'd gladly take him. :D

LOL, well he's done it in the last couple games, not that it helped us tonight. We could only manage 1 run against a guy with a 6.56 ERA.

I'd rather send you Cox if Escobar gets sick of him.

All Star rosters announced for both clubs this afternoon. Biggest surprises for me were the inclusion of Curtis Granderson and Tim Wakefield for the AL. Hoping Greinke gets the starting nod for the AL.

Very disappointed to see a vet tribute All Star nod handed to an undeserving player (Wakefield) over a deserving up and comer (Weaver).

Ryan Howard was obviously going to make it because Manuel is the NL Manager, but Berkman was a more deserving 1B (actually 3 1B reserves is a bit silly).

Except that the game was only really shown in the Philadelphia/New York markets. I feel pretty confident in saying that people who would watch that game in that time slot could care less about Manny's at-bats.

Your point would have more validity if it was a national game shown in prime-time television. There, the more general baseball fan would have as much, if not more interest, in the Manny at-bats. But that wasn't the case in yesterday's game.

And, of course, Moyer and Blanton pitch very well on the heels of Lopez's outing. Nice to get a sweep over your divisional rival after struggling.

Getting Rollins hitting again is huge. Finally, it appears he's accepted that he can't hit 30 HR a season any more and his approaching his AB a lot more intelligently. A little more "Jimmy" and little less "J-Roll", please.

Except that most Boston fans would not watch the Phillies/Mets games regardless. At 4:00 in the afternoon on 4th of July, they're probably using that time to barbeque or do anything than watch baseball. I certainly doubt that they would be motivated to sit through a Mets/Phillies games just for the hell of it or simply to see Manny's at-bats.


Yeah, I agree. But again you're taking a national perspective instead of Logan's/My regional perspective.

Feel free to talk about every freaking Manny at-bat every three seconds on ESPN or any other nationally broadcast station/game. But don't cut into my local Phillies feed for the hell of it.

Further, it might not have been that annoying if they kept the Phils-Mets on the bigger of the split screens and kept the audio on the Phils-Mets game. I don't really need to hear commentators talk about every crotch-itch from an accused steroid user's first at-bat back, thanks.

I'm happy with the NL selection for the most part, I'm hoping Kung Fu Panda (Sandoval) gets in by vote... I also voted for Adam Lind to get in from the AL.

I think both managers did a good job for the most part, but Manuel should have picked Sandoval over Howard (then Howard probably would have gotten in by fan vote, even though I think Kemp deserves it). Maddon's AL reserves have much more positional flexibility though, and that may end up deciding it.

+1

Unless they made a last second switch, you're wrong.
Here's the coverage listing by market, from Abilene to Yuma. Mets-Phils aired up and down the east coast, including major markets Atlanta, DC, and Miami and as at least as far west as Little Rock.

And no, I have no idea off hand why Bangor, ME and Butte, MT both got the Twins vs Tigers instead of either of the other two games.

Fox Sports plans were pretty clear from looking at that web page, they even promoted their coverage ahead of time FOX Sports Mannywood is back. Catch him on MLB on FOX Saturday at 4 PM ET.

ummm wakefield has 10 wins this year - he's hardly undeserving. you can make an argument for weaver (8-3 with a 3.86) over wake (10-3 with a 4.30) but wake is hardly UNDESERVING compared to weaver

Obviously, DT, in your fervor to go get the back of your guy, you didn't bother to look closely enough at Weaver's stats. Go check them again, and come back here when you're done.

It doesn't have to be Weaver. I'll bet there are 10 pitchers not currently on the team who have as good or better of an argument to be on the team than Wakefield.

You know, I really feel like Chone Figgins deserves to be an All Star, and was all set to see if I could make a case for him. Then I saw Lind's stats...WTH, why isn't that guy on the team? And this is coming from a guy who has Lind on his fantasy team, so not like I am completely unaware of how good he's been doing.

Figgy actually has been having a terrific season, and is in the argument for top leadoff hitter in the game, at least in "leadoff hitter" qualities (Crawford has more power, Ichiro hits for more average, etc.), but looking now, I don't see a compelling reason to put him in over Lind, except perhaps for Figgy plays a very good 3B whereas Lind doesn't really seem to bring much in the OF.

It was also nice to see Jason Marquis make it in as well. I always liked him when he was in St. Louis.

There are always guys who can make a case to be on the roster. I would hardly call Wakefield undeserving as mentioned above. He's having a really good season.

2009 ERA+

Weaver: 144
Wakefield: 108

I don't follow the AL as close as the NL, but I agree with you. I was shocked to see what a year Lind is quietly having.

there's always plenty of guys who you can argue should have made it over other guys...it's a popularity contest, plain and simple

Umm, are you seriously citing wins as a barometer of success? Wakefield belongs on the All-Star team in fantasy land; there are 15-20 SP in the AL alone who have been better than him. Weaver may not be my choice (I'd go with Cliff Lee), but you're dreaming if you think Wake is anything other than an absurd choice.

Wakefield is actually 24th in the AL in ERA+. He basically gets to be an all-star because he was lucky enough to be on a good team, and nothing more.

I have nothing against Wakefield (he's actually from my hometown) or the Sox, but to say he's deserving of an All Star spot is absolutely ridiculous.

Millwood would have been a better option than Wakefield. I can't believe he's using wins to justify Wakefield.

Again, this is why the word "really" was placed before shown in the above quote. Sure it shown in Atlanta, DC, and Miami, but do you really think a significant number of viewers in those areas were even planning to watch any baseball that day?

I understand your point about Manny being the bigger story and agree. However, it's more my frustration with national pre-emptive rights to local markets on the weekends. I want the ability/choice to watch every single Phillies game on Comcast SportsNet if that's what I desire. If I want to watch the Phils on the weekend, I unfortunately have to check in with my Fox affiliate.

I know the reasons why, but it won't prevent my bitching.

Eh, it's good to see a guy like Wakefield who's been through a lot finally get an all star birth. You're talking about a guy who was nothing as a minor league hitter, converts to knuckleballer. Then has an amazing first year, and is cut by the end of his second. Is out of baseball for a year, then rebounds with Boston and is still pitching at 42. So, it's a good story, even if Wakefield is not technically deserving. He probably should have made it some time before in his career. Call it the "scent of a woman" birth.

About the same number that watched anywhere else. Nobody stayed home just to watch the Mets, Phillies, Tiger, Twins, Dodgers, Padres, or anybody else yesterday.


Hey, that's all I've been saying.


That's a whole different kettle of fish, you're welcome to bitch on that point if it makes you feel better.

Eight pitchers who belong in the All Star game more than Wakefield:

For reference: Wakefield (10-3, 4.30 ERA, 1.35 WHIP, OPSA .719, ERA+ 108)

Jered Weaver (8-3, 3.10, 1.13 whip, opsa .652, era+ 144)
Kevin Millwood (8-5, 2.80, 1.24 whip, opsa .705, era+ 158)
Nick Blackburn (7-4, 2.94, 1.30 whip, opsa .711, era+ 131)
Matt Garza (6-5, 3.49, 1.18 whip, opsa .656, era+ 129)
James Shields (6-6, 3.50, 1.27 whip, opsa .756, era+ 127)
John Danks (7-6, 3.76, 1.23 whip, opsa .683, era+ 122)
CC Sabathia (6-5, 3.85, 1.15 whip, opsa .642, era+ 114)
Brian Bannister (6-6, 3.87, 1.30 whip, opsa .683, era+ 109)

That's just starters. I also skipped over anyone with a sub-.500 record who otherwise deserved, such as Cliff Lee, Jarrod Washburn and Dallas Braden. I didn't consider some other pitchers--closers--having great seasons, like Bobby Jenks, George Sherrill, David Aardsma, Frank Francisco and Joakim Soria. And I didn't include anyone who is at least comparable to be considered with Wakefield, like AJ Burnett, CC Sabathia, Jon Lester, Andy Pettitte.

Incidentally, several of the starters above also have better stats than Josh Beckett, but I have less of an issue including him. After going through this, I think Millwood has even more of a case to be pissed than Weaver.

I actually like Wakefield. I like the story, and he's never been a bad guy. And I am not saying he's having a bad season, he's not, he's doing quite well.

But there are a ton of players more deserving than him. If it was one or two, it would be one thing, but, damn, just look at my last post for some excellent examples of guys staying home next week who by all rights should be in this game over Wakefield, any one of them.

Yup, I dicovered this while researching to counter DT. Millwood's actually the guy with the biggest gripe, and that's coming from an Angels fan.

Wins have always been the "sexy" stat as far as pitching goes. I believe Chris Carpenter belongs in the All Star game.. but I've heard a few reporters who say his last two losses (no run support) cost him his chance - and like some of you, I agree that is complete bs... BUT it's not going to change anytime soon.

Also irritating. No Braves pitcher made it. Jurrjens and his 154 ERA+ gets left out in favor of guys like Santana (127) and Billingsley (134), almost certainly because of his 6-6 record.

yeah. we can sit here and bitch about WHIP and ERA+ and advanced metrics, but the bottom line is so few people in the game are conversant in those stats, and they're certainly not about to choose All Stars or Gold Gloves or Silver Sluggers or anything based on advanced metrics. that's why Jeter keeps winning Gold Gloves at shortstop even though he doesn't deserve them

And even on the ajc.com poll as of a little while ago just over half the respondents said McCann was indeed the only Brave deserving of being an All-Star. You can bet his 6-6 record has a lot to do with that. If he was 9-3 there'd be a lot more people up in arms.

I think it gets lost sometimes how few people -- those who buy tickets, those who watch games, those who watch the All-Star game -- have any idea that ERA+ isn't a laundry detergent or that outside of fantasy baseball players that WHIP isn't something used by athletes with some serious strange sex lives.

Right, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't still be upset about it or stop talking about it, and that's not a response to someone saying Wakefield is undeserving. It just means he's deserving under the stupid criteria that most people use.

can we talk more about how the douchebag steroid-cheaters Aroid and ManRam aren't invited to the game and how happy that makes me??

I think Wakefield made it over Weaver because he's more clutch and has more wins.

:lol:

LOL, and quite true. It is unfortunate how Wins get used. At least Quality Starts should be easy enough to understand. Jurrijens, who is a fantasic pitcher, gets screwed because the Braves offense sucks horribly. How is that fair at all?

I can't believe a 4.30 ERA is All-Star-worthy. Plus, he has like 50 Ks. What a joke. Santana over Jurrjens is at least semi-justifiable. I don't know what would possess them to select Wakefield other than the Red Sox score runs when he pitches. He's so below average, they don't even use him in the playoffs unless all other options are exhausted.

The NL Pitchers seem stranger and stranger to me as I look at them. Jurrijens doesn't make it, but neither does Gallardo? The guy who not only has a 154 ERA+ (2.75 ERA), but an 8-5 record? Neither Johnny Cueto, who has a 165 ERA+ (2.69 ERA), but an 8-4 record? Though I understand why Ted Lilly had to go (they had to fill a Cubs spot), Marquis was unnecessary (as Colorado already had Hawpe). I can even see Billingsley (Dodgers are by far the best team in the NL, so give 'em more). Santana should have been asked to take a seat, but I wonder if Manuel was scared that the Mets would consider it a snub and use it as bulletin board material or something.

Good to see a year where the All-Star player from the Royals is at least deserving of that honor rather than being added to comply with a rule. Congrats to Zack on his great 1st half of the year.

Phils explode on the Reds...10-0 after one inning.

I guess Cole can't complain about a lack of run support tonight.

Especially when he drove 2 in himself.

And after I just sang the praises of Cueto... of course.

Not likely. Manuel went with Santana because Santana gives him a better chance to win the game than Cueto or Jurrjens. For the managers (at least those still in the playoffs), they're going to go with the pitchers that they think give them the best chance to win, not those who necessarily deserve to be there.

Besides, I think you're giving Manuel too much credit. I love the guy, but I doubt he's smart enough to worry about potential bulletin board material to the mets.

bah - smoltzy is looking mortal in his first fenway start

The Royals traded cash and a PTBNL for Ryan Freel today for reasons that elude... everyone.

SI

Philly might just drop a 20-spot on the Reds. Hopefully, this means only good things.

Make that a 22-spot. :D

It's a shame that Hamels didn't pitch to the score and allow 21 runs so we could potentially hear Joe Morgan argue that it's just as hard to win 22-21 as it is to win 1-0.

Hamels scored more runs tonight with his bat than the Reds did.

Fixed that for you.

Jason Marquis, scoffing as his FOFC critics, continues to work his first half magic as he has gone 8 shutout innings against Washington. On the verge of back-to-back shutout wins, with this one being at Coors.

Good for Jason!

In all seriousness, the Marquis track record suggests that he'll be substantially worse in the second half. That plus Coors Field could get really, really scary. But Colorado has to be ecstatic with what they have gotten out of him so far.

VOTE FOR PABLO!

He just hit a grand slam. Kalifornia, I expect those 500 votes!@

Actually I'd say he's the textbook definition of league average. The one point in his favor vs. other starters is he can be thrown out there on whatever rest and throw however many innings if it goes extras like last year. Beckett (and some others) is scheduled to start the 12th and I don't want him possibly thrown out there late because they're running out of pitchers.

Hahahahaha. Yeahhhh. Well...I've got my plans for tomorrow. Hope my fingers don't fall off. If it helps get Pablito into the ASG, then it's worth it.

During the Braves game, they said Francoeur to the Royals was a rumor with legs, as the Moore was involved in drafting him. That would be epic. I think they mentioned that a Guillen/Francoeur swap would be a possibility, in which case the Braves would be silly.

They've been talking about Francoeur to the Royals for a couple of months. Rany (I think - there are so many Royals-centric bloggers out there) even wrote an article attempting to justify it several weeks ago.

I don't think it's too bad. The Cubs are paying his entire salary. The Royals get a veteran utility guy who will likely warrant no more than a single or double-A minor league player when all is said and done.

My guess is that they're going to move a Teahan or Guillen in the near future and want a defensive guy to cover all positions in the outfield in addition to a backup SS now that Aviles is out.

Nice 3 game win streak for the boys in blue. Hope they keep it going.

Wait until he starts talking about Farney. Freel may have run into the wall a few too many times.

I've already read some about Farney. Just think, he can talk to crazy personal Farny and relief pitcher, game blower extraordinaire Farnsy on the same team.

Yeah, the only thing people can come up with for why this move was done is that he's basically free- the prospect they trade better not be worth anything- and that someone else is about to be moved and they need a warm body to take the field.

SI

Correct me if I'm wrong, but they can also negotiate it to a cash deal as well, can they not?

I never saw any language saying that but that doesn't mean it's possible. I thought the trade was cash considerations + a player to be named later. It doesn't make any sense for the Cubs to just dump him and pay his salary- they would have just cut him then, correct?

SI

Anyone see the story about the ump who was stupid enough to tell Jeter he was out not because he was tagged, but because the ball beat him to the bag so he didn't have to be tagged? I know that's gone on for years (although apparently it was actually allowed in years past but now is not supposed to be), but what kind of moron says something like that out loud?

I guess my scenario was that the Royals might reimburse some of that salary depending on performance.

I'm not worried about any good prospects being moved. If we're moving a decent prospect, it's likely because he played like an All-Star the second half of the season. There's a reason you never hear about teams arguing too much about 'player to be named later'. They're not expecting much in return outside of a warm body.

When a PTBNL is included in a deal, both teams agree on a list of players that the receiving team will be able to select from down the road. So it won't matter how Freel performs.

Some PTBNLs have turned into good players, although its obviously rare. Sometimes you'll see a more talented guy go is if he's not eligible to be traded or hurt.

Supposedly the PTBNL that the Padres are getting from the A's in the Hairston deal is a good player, possibly the best player of the three (Padres fans hope, anyway).

Same with the Cards and the Mark DeRosa deal- the player going back to Cleveland along with Perez was supposed to be a "substantial" player to be named later- or some such similar language.

SI

News out of Toronto that J.P. Ricciardi will listen to offers for Roy Halladay.

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/story/?id=283950

:(

Every team listens to offers about every player. You would be stupid not to. I doubt any team would be willing or able to meet the price for Halladay. If they trade him for less than an overwhelming package, then it is clear they were actively shopping him. If they get a great deal, then that just means the potential of the players they got outweighed another year and a half worth of Halladay (plus a potential mega-bucks deal after that, compared to 3 or 4 cheap players under team control for 3-6 years).

I know every team should listen, but really, if JP is in Toronto longer than Doc and there is no career ending injury involved I might just be done as a fan until JP leaves the organization.

Call it an over reaction or being dramatic or whatever you like, but this guy is absolutely killing me as a fan.

Brewers say Gamel and Escobar are untouchable but if it's Roy Halladay we are talking about here you'd think they'd reconsider.

Beats those silly Braves fans I've been hearing thinking that any package for Javier Vazquez ought to include Prince Fielder or Ryan Braun.