Co-sign to this. Similar to my rural upbringing

Need some time to keep perspective here, but an early player for "favorite post of all time on FOFC" for me. alb is just crushing it over here. I might even actually go read Patchen. j/k nah

Let us not be defined by the poets we liked when we were sophomores.

Arles' discussion in the other thread, stating that the president/administration might not really have made any difference brought me here. It got me thinking. I'm certainly not a fan of how Trump has managed the governmet's response, but his declaration of emergency and the gravity of his remarks on March 13(?) is probably the single most impactful event that has influenced outcomes to date. That big positive is countered by a lot
CDC and other agencies hampering early testing
Bureaucratic stonewalling with early PPE concerns/preparedness
No National organization managing PPE or ventilator shortages.

I figure that any other president might have have got some of those things right, but I don't think that is a sure bet. Arles may not be far from the truth. The president gets mixed marks on handling the Pandemic so far.

That said, I wonder if Trump's rush to re open things, pushing governors on churches etc. is going to be the difference maker for him and really how well/poorly the country fares the rest of this year. I don't think we'll have a sense for his final grade in pandemic response till this runs its course.

Straight out of the autocrats playbook.

So...help me follow this.

If baby shuts down twitter where is baby going to complain about twitter?

So, Twitter is forced to sue under assorted free speech clauses and since there's a lawsuit involved, suspends Trump's account waiting for a ruling. Trump is addicted to Tweeting because he doesn't do any work aside from golfing, so he'll lose his mind.

Clever.

He doesn't want it shutdown, he wants to control the speech on it. Just autocratic crap his bootlicking sycophants will lap up.

Just a distraction as the COVID death toll reaches 100k.

The EO will do nothing.

It is red meat for the base.

It is a distraction from his failures.

It is about the media, so the media will take the bait.

dola, in fairness to Trump, though, it isn't entirely a calculated distraction.

He sincerely and honestly does care more about his tweets than a hundred thousand dead Americans.

Exactly. It is nothing but pandering to his base. Showing he is their champion against the big bad media trying to stomp him down every chance they get.

I get why Jack won't ban him, but man, it would be glorious if they did.

"The move highlights what Trump believes is a fight worth having. In many ways, the latest episode with Twitter feeds Trump's narrative that there are powerful forces in the media aligned against him, and that his is the only voice his supporters can trust.
"This plays right into President Trump's hands," said Jason Miller, the communications director for Trump's 2016 campaign and someone who has been directly involved with Trump's social media strategy. "They basically handed him a massive gift."
Yup. The media lemmings run off the cliff for him again.

It is, however, a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.

When someone with a huge following lies about basic facts, you either let them get away with it, or you "pick a fight" with them. Neither is a great option.

And the particular lie in this case--that vote by mail leads to increased fraud--is actually something that a lot of people might believe. So there was some real value in pointing people to actual facts.

Doesn't matter what Twitter does with his tweets. They could claim they are all true. It's a private company that has a right to do what it wants on their platform. Don't like it? Post on another.

Actually it's a publicly traded company, not a private company. But still. Agree to their TOS? You play by their rules. What Trump is trying to do is effectively limit Twitter's free speech.

Also Twitter is Trump's biggest megaphone. Even if he could do anything he's shooting himself in the foot here. Remember that Milo Yiannopolous guy, when he got banned? Ever hear from him anymore? Lose Twitter lose the election.

The only to get him to stop is to simply ignore him. I realize that is a near impossible task seeing what his position is, but the media needs to stop reporting on every word, every tweet, etc and just focused on his actions.

This is a five year old we are talking about. Rewarding him with attention for repeated poor behavior is only going to increase that behavior.

TRUMP 2020: Because you can't really prove that it matters who the President is.

Sold my TWTR today to hopefully pick up on a swoon. I expect a lot more turbulence around this Social Media topic the next 3 months.

NO unemployment for YOU!

Burning in effigy is soooooooo 18th century.

Epic rant by Brian Sims of the PA legislature today. At least one Rep was positive and the GOP leadership hid it for weeks. While they kept passing trash bills to reopen the state.

Pa. Rep. Brian Sims calls out GOP members for hiding coronavirus cases

This is the appropriate level of pissed off

I have a feeling we might see more of this in the next day or two

SI

There's hope yet but we'll have to wait on his speech.

https://www.foxnews.com/media/marc-t...kong-crackdown

Today should be very calm and rational.

Useful reference.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...nated-in-1968/

Your money quote, after relating a series of unspeakable horrors against Americans:


There is, incidentally, no bottom... no depths to which this person (the one in the news today) and those around him will not gleefully stoop. Don't look for it.

Minnesota police arrest CNN reporter and camera crew as they report from protests in Minneapolis https://t.co/oZdqBti776 pic.twitter.com/3QbeTjD5ed

— CNN (@CNN) May 29, 2020

This is fine.

They were standing where they where supposed to stand. They followed instructions and the police just arrested them. Watch Trump praise the police for stopping the "fake news."

It said right on their hats and jackets "Enemy of the People," it's a good arrest.

Mrs Q was up late, bemoaning the "when they start looting, we start shooting." She went down that road, yet again, of "well, that HAS to be the end for him, not even the republicans could back THAT up..."

She really needed sleep. So I didn't tell her.

The official White House account did a copy and paste job on the President's censured* Tweet. If the One True Dark Jedi were in charge of Twitter, that's an automatic banning, no questions asked. :D


*--Note spelling.

This twitter thread looks like the best quick reference for the quote context needed today (and on this page of this forum thread):

1/ This line in Trump’s tweet: “when the looting starts, the shooting starts”... is a quote from Miami Police Chief Walter Headley

In Dec 1967, months before riots at GOP Convention in Miami, Headley used that quote to announce “get tough” policy for policing black neighborhoods

— igorvolsky (@igorvolsky) May 29, 2020

I want to say "thanks for the read" but that doesn't appear to be the correct sentiment as it's both explanatory and depressing in the "history often rhymes" sense.

SI

I get that some people will focus on the historical context, but which is more likely:

1. That Donald Trump the historian was waxing nostalgic about the good old days when America was great and the police kept black people in their place, using a historically-relevant quote?

2. That Donald Trump the faux tough guy and general all-around nitwit heard what he considered to be a tough and kewl-sounding rhyme and used it with no knowledge of its origins.

Yeah, I vote #2. Do I think he is a racist? Yes. Do I also think he is a mouth-breathing simpleton? Yes. The fact that he hates these protesters and glorifies the ones in Michigan is a manifestation of the former, but the use of this specific quote is a manifestation of the latter. I think that Twitter thread is giving him far too much credit.

All fair. Also in play that a different terrible person in/around the WH was really behind the tweet and offered the quote as "strong" to appeal to President Goldfish's paltry vocabulary.

It’s just pandering. Similarly to his initial tweet, what less than 48 hours ago, that there will be justice. That was just a tweet trying to pander to those he thought he could benefit off of the Biden “you’re not black” news cycle. Speaking of which that feels like it has long been forgotten now.

Yes. That’s pretty much precisely my thinking there, that Steven Miller or some other ghoul fed him that line and he regurgitated it because it sounded teh awesome to him.

When talking to my wife about it, my first guess was someone from the Stephen Miller branch of idiocy. But I'm with Ben - there's no way Trump actually retained that quote and could use it "properly" He was fed it from somewhere.

EDIT: I feel bad because I basically regurgitated what Ben said but like 10 minutes later because I hadn't refreshed the thread.

SI

I 100% think that quote came from Miller or one of his lackey's. Trump has the attention span of a gnat and certainly isn't versed in the history of civil rights in America to even connect the dots.

This opinion piece is very on topic.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...d8d_story.html

I think there's a chance that a guy that was an adult in 1967, who was a racist, who grew up in a racist family, and who keeps talking about a time when America was great, might remember a phrase like that even if he can't tell you the history of the words.

It's amazing isn't it. Nary one rebuke from Republicans...this is the America they want.

I think Trump wants riots to show how tough he is on the blacks just like the wall was for Mexicans.

I love how Lindsey Graham was asking old judges to retire so they could shunt new ones in.

I think by the time Trump leaves office (big IF if he steals the one this fall), he'll have damaged things so much it'll take decades to fix and build trust if ever.

We're just going to stagger around until someone competent follows his ideals and finishes breaking it.

Sadly, I think that's where this is all leading

SI

Unless they take a drubbing in the Fall. In which case, don't you know, it's all about fiscal responsibility and how dare you bring up the past. I'm just a libertarian leaning conservative who cares about the debt. I hold Republicans and Democrats to the same standard, and I am offended you would imply otherwise. I am very smart.

You are the one bringing up ancient history like the most recent Republican President who had broad approval with both the voters and elected leaders of his party. Every time I try to make a point, you just say "Trump, Trump, Trump." You know most Republicans didn't even like Trump. We just want economic growth and low crime. Why are you against that?

And Dem leaders will play along refusing to investigate the Trump years and urging that we all look forward so we can work together to solve the country's problems.

...at least as likely is that during one of his rallies somewhere in dumbfuckistan, he had an opening act racist sheriff or whatnot give a fluffer speech as a welcome, and drop that line along the way. It rhymes, and carries a distinct whiff of being racist, so it could pass the test of being something he'd just pick up for a time like this.

Yeah. I'm just not sure someone has to feed him racist, authoritarian slogans. He's perfectly capable of picking those up on his own.

The racial divisiveness that Trump has brought into his presidency is really sad. Not only does he lack any kind of normal awareness, but I don't think he really understands the kind of damage his actions are doing to the collective psyche of our country. I agree that it is going to take years to repair all this.

Ted Cruz is such an embarrassment. He's asked for a criminal investigation into Twitter.

You'll never win back Daddy's love, Ted.

It's obviously option #2. But we know the script by now. Nobody on the right can acknowledge that Dear Leader doesn't know what he's talking about, least of all Trump himself, so now we have to do the revisionist history dance where well actually Walter Headley is good and here's why. It's already exhausting and it's barely started.

Of course 2 is at least equally likely, but is that a good thing as far as being qualified for his role ?

Also, now he is using the White House Twitter to propagate his innane thoughts. The line between Person and government are blurred beyond regognition by now. Which is utterly shocking considering how well received american democracy was not thaaat long ago.

And is my mind playing tricks or was there (early on) at least some pretense that he was speaking for himself early on, not for the 'country/government' ?

Definitely, in general. And maybe it's a complete coincidence that he used the exact phrasing of a well-documented white supremacist from Florida. Seems more likely that this particular slogan got there deliberately, rather than by accident.

Looting leads to shooting, and that’s why a man was shot and killed in Minneapolis on Wednesday night - or look at what just happened in Louisville with 7 people shot. I don’t want this to happen, and that’s what the expression put out last night means....

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) May 29, 2020

oh, he wasn't threatening to kill Americans after all, nothing to see here, thanks Big Don

Trump opening up new debates in English, law, and philosophy.

wow either someone else wrote that response or he came off a high. Complete sentences, no excalmation marks or capital letters.

No chance he wrote that. The easy tell will be when he gives up the con during the next time he's in front of a microphone.

Trump prodigy learned well from the master. GBI investigation finds no basis for Kemp's 2018 hacking accusation.


First make a completely baseless claim and start an investigation right before an election. When the investigation finds nothing well after the damage was done, then continue to make the false claim and completely ignore the findings.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/29/trum...anization.html

I can't say I'm a fan of Trump or the WHO but maybe this will save the US a few bucks while we're running trillion dollar deficits.

Pocket change really (yes for a trillion dollar budget, $450mil is 0.045% and the US's budget is closer to $4trillion) ... and seems like he'd run into some legal hurdles there as well due to Congressional appropriation.

Too lazy to do diplomacy, so we'll just cede the world's organizations to China.

Really it's the logical conclusion from pulling out of the TPP.

Definitely won't come back to bite us later

SI

I think eradicating polio and such is a good cause and worth the money.

I think for Trump it is option #2, but he definitely heard it from someone who believes in option #1.

Watching Jeffrey Epstien: filthy Rich,

He was friends with Donald Trump. Who was quoted as saying he liked them young. As he did.

Headlines once again tell you about the news source. Front page of the two major news sites:

"Pain and Anger across America" - that seems pretty accurate to me
"Rage across America" - accurate-ish, but gotta get in your five minutes of hate/fear rather than trying to tell the whole story

Fox News is always very good at what they do, though. In one sub-headline stories, they find a conservative to condemn the riots with a story that spends about 1/4 of the article talking about Floyd and then 3/4ths about the riots. And in the other, they have the story "Black firefighter laments bar going up in the smoke of Minneapolis riots", which is of course the last of the three major stories on a page, the other two trying as hard as possible to portray people as animals and looks like the journalistic equivalent of "but I have black friends"

SI

SCOTUS upholds California's restrictions on religious services by a 5-4 vote, with Roberts joining the liberal justices.

Also darkly hilarious:
CNN: "Our reporter was arrested by the police for being black"
FoxNews: "Oh yeah, well, the people at the protest were mean to us, too"

No, going after reporters for any network is not right. But there is a bit of a difference. If it's the police arresting you for reporting, that's one thing. If the protesters view you as part of the problem, that's kindof another.

SI

Get tough Democrat Mayors and Governors. These people are ANARCHISTS. Call in our National Guard NOW. The World is watching and laughing at you and Sleepy Joe. Is this what America wants? NO!!!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) May 31, 2020

Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't think blaming it on Biden will work.

I don't think so. ABC/Washington Post poll (yes single poll warnings) shows Biden up 10 on Trump. We have Lindsay Graham publicly asking judges over 60 to retire so they can replace them now. The White House is also keeping Trump off of live TV which tells you all you need to know about their faith in him as a leader.

I'm wondering where all the conservatives I saw complaining that Obama was a divisive President are now? If this level of unrest along with a pandemic were to happen under Obama's (or any Dem's) Presidency we'd see militia's mobilized.

Blaming the Democrats can work...and has. Check out the '68 and '92 elections. Both after riots. Both republican candidates campaigned on a platform of law and order.

The next couple of weeks will probably be a big swing for Trump if nothing else major happens, because we should also see an uptick in COVID-19 cases, which he'll blame on the Dems as well.

I don't think law and order is the correct message right now. All it does is continue to motivate his base, which means that's likely what Trump will do, but at some point he does have to bring in others.

They're keeping Trump off of TV for a reason. His messaging isn't helping them for November.

He already has that vote. Harris siphons off some of it but that's a vote he has. He needs to get the middle and I don't think 2020 has been kind to him in this regard.

The Trump Presidency – 2016
 

Yeah, Law and Order only gets him so far and most of the non MAGA crowd think he's done terrible with law and order, considering his adminstration to be lawless and chaotic. He's not as trusted as H.W. or even Nixon


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Here's a thread from Twitter that gives one view of where we're headed: G. Elliott Morris on Twitter: "I have been trying to process this week’s unrest through the historical lens of the (GOP-driven) politicization of protests against police brutality & the corresponding political importance of (white) racial rage & some things have become very clear to me on what happens next. 1/"

But Bush lost and Nixon wasn't the incumbent. I don't see how a message of, "I can fix this" works when you're already the President. This is what the country looks like with Trump in charge.

Just a total side thought: One of the things I'm glad I did a few years ago was start to follow people on Twitter whom I didn't think I'd agree with because I wanted to understand how others thought about things. Some, I stopped following because it was all "But Obama" this and "Trump Deranged Syndrome" that without much to back it up. But others had good points: things I didn't agree with but at least I could see how they got to that conclusion. And it's refined my point of view of things. That's the reason I really appreciate hearing the viewpoints of everyone here and I'm very thankful that when I ask questions, I get an honest answer.

Guess that's a long way to say thank you all for being you and allowing this forum to share ideas and opinions. If more could do this, we'd have a better place for everyone to live.

You're right, sorry. He tried to use it for law and order and it didn't work. And I don't see how Trump can use that message either.

But then again, who saw Trump being able to use the messages he did and be elected in the first place? I know I didn't.

I still think Trump is the favorite based on incumbency, but he's IMO running the worst possible campaign so far.

Lets not forget

The election is in five months.

Five months ago, we were still in the impeachment. Most of us had not even heard of this weird virus in China.

Now, amazingly, the pandemic (which hasn't ended) is old news. And the impeachment feels about as relevant as Andrew Johnson's.

What the holy fuck will things be like five months from now?

Unfortunately, I think the pandemic will be back worse than ever and will have forced itself back into the top spot in the news. I hope to be wrong.

Agreed on both counts. I fear you are right, I hope to be wrong.

SI

Remember that tweet when Trump said he watched everything from the WH and felt safe the whole time? Turns out he was worried for his safety and the Secret Service took him to the underground bunker.

What else would one expect from President Bone Spurs.

All he can do is project what he wants himself to be. He’ll never be that person or even 1% of it.

Trump made sure to tell the nation that a TV host is pretty sure there are no white supremacist organizations inciting violence. Solid priorities.

If Charlotte ends up not allowing the GOP convention to occur there in August, I REALLY hope that Atlanta doesn't host it like Kemp has been suggesting.

The picture of the White House with no lights on is so poetic.

Oh my.

ATL Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms asked right now on CNN if President Trump is capable of delivering a unifying national message:

“I think he is capable of reading one.”

— Jonathan Tamari (@JonathanTamari) June 1, 2020

From Trump's call with the Governors today. We're getting into Downfall territory.

they ran out of snickers...

I probably would have hung up right there if that was the kind of "help" we would be getting from the President of the US

So were you using "the lights out and nobody's home" more literally or more metaphorically?

SI

Heh

The Lincoln Project is going to be all over it.