Looks like the Henry brothers will be transferring to Kansas. No surprise there as Self has been cutting scholarships, errrr, players have been requesting transfers of late to make room on the squad.

FOX Sports on MSN - COLLEGE BASKETBALL - Sources: Xavier Henry, brother pick Kansas

Being the wealth of basketball knowledge that you are, you are aware that coaches and schools can choose not renew a scholarship? Players are not on four-five year rides, right?

Don't let MBBF bother ya Bug. He's just upset because his Tigers lost a recruit to South Florida. Must be another coaching staff willing to pay their players while Clean Program Anderson won't stoop to their level. Makes you wonder how Missouri football coach Gary Pinkel lands quality recruits in football then yet Anderson won't land those players because he runs a clean program. Someone do the math please.

Of course. That was the point of the post. Elite level teams can make those kinds of moves without suffering any consequences. That's the way it's always been. If a team outside of the top few legacy teams makes that move, it's heavily used against them in recruiting by other coaches to show the disloyalty of a coach. Such is life in the cut-throat world of college basketball.

It's a pretty shady move, but at the same time, those players know what they're getting into when they go to a program like Kansas, Duke, Kentucky, North Carolina, etc. If you don't perform, you're going to get cut for the next big thing.

Obviously, you didn't pay attention to the recruitment of Famous. He had family near both Seton Hall and South Florida. As was mentioned previously in this thread, it was a stretch for Mizzou to get Famous due to his expressed preferrence to play near family. There was no dirty recruiting by South Florida, contrary to your statement implying that they did so.

I'm sure he was wrong about scholarships being pulled like he was claiming. I suspect Self had one of those conversations where he told the two players transferring that they probably won't get playing time and it's in their best interest to transfer. But you know MBBF won't let facts or even the most likely scenario get in the way of a good story, if it suits his purposes.

SI

I was being sarcastic, but was implying basically what you are saying. The intent is pulling the scholarship to give it to a better player, no matter how the message is delivered. Most KU fans dismiss these kinds of things in this manner since it's a pretty common occurance at their school.

I looked but couldn't find a sarcasm smiley.

Every college coach does this. I can guarantee you that Mike Anderson sat down at the end of the season and spoke with every single Missouri basketball player and let them know what next year would be like for them, how many minutes they might get, what they need to work on, etc. Missouri football's Drew Temple left the team this past season to find more playing time at a smaller school. I guess I could be "sarcastic" and imply that Pinkel pulled his scholarship and gave it to a better player.

John Wall...what an idiot!

Better yet, he's 18, so he's officially an adult.

Shouldn't hurt his NBA plans and I'm sure some college will take the risk on him, but it's still disappointing to see a kid do something this stupid.

Arizona just got another 3-star recruit for this fall in Kevin Parrom (who chose Arizona over Pitt). That's 3 very good recruits for this fall for Miller (with Hall and Natyazhko).

In another somewhat surprise, it seems Arizona is now in the mix for the No. 11 player on Rivals.com's list for this fall - Lance Stevenson (NY kid). It looks like it's between Memphis, UCLA, Kansas, St. John's, Maryland and Arizona. Long odds, but crazy that Arizona found its way in the discussion.

Mizzou picked up two athletes over the weekend when they visited. They were both 3-star guys who fit the Anderson prototype. Long arms and can really run. One of them (Underwood) averaged 8.6 blocks per game his senior year.

Mizzou is starting to look more and more like a Calipari team. 8 guys who are 6'6" or taller. A few years ago, we had a 6'5 guy starting at PF. Those days appear to be long gone.

Stephenson is once a package deal with Sidney. That should tell you all you want to know about the kid

Yeah, I read on AZ rivals that Stephenson's camp may be floating Arizona out there to try and get him some better options. The main writer for the Arizona site said he didn't think Miller was that interested right now.

I'll agree that this kid has some red flags and I'd be a little careful here. That said, when you start recruiting in April for the upcoming fall, you can't really be all that choosy with your openings ;)

Boy, this would be a REALLY bad rules decision if it goes through. This rule actually provides incentive to injure a player when fouling them in order to get a weaker shooter on the line at the end of the game.

Proposed new rule would change foul shooter - Kansas City Star

Its the rule in the NBA, it has eliminated faking injuries to get better foul shooters and has provided no such incentive to injure people.

Sweep the leg !!!

As though they need an extra incentive?

You're right. From the two playoff games I watched on Wednesday, the NBA players prefer to elbow and slug people in full view of the referee rather than being tactful about it.

Also, the fact that the NBA uses the rule is an excellent reason to proceed in the exact OPPOSITE direction in that regard.

The NBA rule also states that if it's a flagrant foul, then the coach of the shooting team gets to choose who shoots the free throw. So really, there's no incentive for hard fouls at all (unless your name is Kobe ;) )...

Which is exactly how the rule should be. The draft of the NCAA rule currently does not have that verbiage. Perhaps it will eventually.

An interesting note to some Memphis fans who I know are lurking. Mizzou just signed a kid (Tyler Stone) out of Memphis who's dad played for Memphis State. I didn't know who he was initially, but I'm sure that fans of the program will remember him.......

TheDraftReview - James Bradley

Mizzou, I understand your sentiments on the free throw thing, but I always thought it was a bit fishy when the guy who got hurt ends up going out and some point guard bench guy comes in for the big man. I'm not just talking about the Mizzou situation (which I don't even think was a big man getting hurt or a bad free throw shooter...wasn't it Tiller? Isn't he decent at free throws?), but I know OU at one game this year got to take Blake out and a halfway decent FT shooter came in. Guess what? Blake came back in on the next dead ball. Now, both guys were probably shaken up, but there's a difference between that and being actually too dehabilitated to shoot free throws.

Sure. I understand that the situation isn't optimal, but this isn't the way to fix it.

Yeah, the Mizzou situation was Tiller, who is actually a good FT shooter. He had surgery to repair that wrist after the season, so he obviously wasn't faking in that instance. Also, Mike Anderson actually brought in a freshman who had a worse FT% than Tiller even though another player on the bench had a better FT%, so it obviously wasn't motivated by statistics.

Yeah, late in the game like that you need to make sure that it's a guy who can stay in until the next possession. I like that the coach is limited to players that aren't on the bench though. But, I kind of disagree about trying to hurt guys. I think that there's already enough incentive to hurt guys--namely, that if they get hurt bad enough, they'll have to sit out because they will be too hurt to play. I don't think that them being a good free throw shooter really changes that dynamic any more than it was there otherwise. There aren't that many guys headhunting in the heat of the moment, and those that are will probably try to take the guy down regardless of who gets to pick who shoots the free throws. I do think there's a greater dynamic of getting fouled and deciding that it might be best to take one for the team (albiet, not much greater because you have to think most kids are competitors).

Tiller's surgery was actually due to an injury against Texas earlier in the season when Mason fouled him on a layup. He would have had surgery whether he was fouled in the Memphis game or not, but the foul certainly didn't help the injury.

I don't think Mike Anderson meant to make the situation seem fishy. The situation was that Tiller came out of the game and then went right back in after the free throws. I don't doubt that he was injured, but the fact he was back in the game shows you he was likely healthy enough to take the free throws. Instead of a 70% shooter he would have likely been a 60% shooter with a hurt wrist. Just look back when Tiller originally injured it against Texas and he followed that up with hitting one of two free throws. I'm guessing Tiller or Anderson decided to not take the chance against Memphis. I believe this is why they made the rule change. Again, I don't think Anderson was trying to cheat the system, but you can't argue that Tiller likely could have taken the free throws...just not as well as he normally could.

Stephenson is a great talent, but he's kind of snake bitten right now. He was close to a commitment with Kansas, but then they land Henry. St. Johns would be a great situation for him, but his family wants to get him out of the area so it makes them a non-factor at this point. Memphis makes a lot of sense because of immediate playing time, but I don't know what the interest is there.

As for John Wall, I'm really hoping he tries to challenge the NBA system and go pro. I would love to see the NBA age limit rule get nixed in the next player's and owner's agreement.

Oklahoma already-thin front line just got even thinner. Patillo, a big player for Oklahoma through league play and the tournament, has been booted from the team for violating team policy. They've now lost their top two forwards, neither of which was a senior last year.

Oklahoma dismisses forward Pattillo for violating team policy - NCAA Division I Mens Basketball - CBSSports.com News, Fantasy, Video

Interesting turn-about here. Jarrid Famous is now asking to be released from his South Florida commitment. Two assistant coaches that recruited him left the program and Stan Heath didn't let him know about the changes. He's planning to sit out the season if he isn't released. Sounds like he'll go to Arizona.

USF's top hoops recruit wants out

Sigh. Well at least USF had a tourney appearance while I was there...

Both Lamont Jones (USC, trying to get out of his LOI with the Floyd stuff) and Famous could potentially land in Arizona. Still, I doubt it. Even if USC let Jones out of his LOI, they may very well stipulate he can't play for a Pac-10 school. There's also a ton of vague info on the Famous issue with Jarrid's dad saying the following in the The St. Petersburg Times:

"Jarrid is going to South Florida. He's not switching schools," Jerome Famous said. "He's going to South Florida, no doubt about it."

At the end, I think both guys stay at their current schools.

Does the Pac-10 not have a conference transfer rule to avoid recruiting and transferring between schools in conference? For example, if you want to transfer between Big 12 schools, you have to sit out two years and lose one year of eligibility. It's extremely rare to have transfers in conference for that reason. Luke Axtell was the last one that I can think of (went from Texas to Kansas).

I don't think so, but it's up to the LOI school to set the parameters of allowing a kid to transfer and play this season. So, USC or SF could release their kid from the LOI with the stipulation that they don't play for Arizona (or a Pac-10 team).

It's a different situation if you let a kid out of a LOI compared to having someone currently enrolled actually transfer.

True. Good point.

John Wall's decision to apply or not centered around the interpretation of whether or not he was eligible under the current rule (apparently, it was somewhat ambiguous). He never intended to challenge the current rule. Doing so would seem somewhat foolish considering that the federal court system ruled emphatically in the Maurice Clarett/Mike Williams case that collectively bargained age limits are legal.

As for the next round of CBA, the age limit is likely to get raised to two years after high school. It probably has no chance of going away.

Sophomore guard Terrence Oglesby leaving Clemson, to play in Europe - ESPN

Clemson 3 point threat Terrance Oglesby leaves college after two years to go play in Europe.

That sucks for Clemson. Oglesby was a bit of a shot hog when he was in the game though, and a defensive liability... so it's not going to be a total disaster. They just won't shoot the 3 as well next year with he and Rivers gone... but they have never been a good 3-point shooting team anyway even with Oglesby around.

There is a rule in the PAC-10 that you must sit two years, but most coaches will waive it.

Isn't that just for transfers?

I am hoping that Noel Johnson and Momo Jones land at Memphis. We really need a PG next year. There is the talk of Lance Stephenson going to Memphis, Arizona, or Maryland. But there are some issues with his amateur status and the people that surround him.

I'm hoping Stephenson doesn't end up at Arizona. The more I read about him, the more I cringe.

The last Big 12 player to transfer within the conference was Lucas from Baylor to Oklahoma State following the Bliss firing. I believe Lucas was even given an exemption from the Big 12 transfer rules because of the situation.

I never meant to suggest Wall was going to apply for the NBA draft. I only meant I'd like to see him challenge the NBA draft rule simply because I think the rule is a farce. The rule is basically in place so that NBA scouts no longer have to scout high school basketball games. So now the college ranks have become what the NBDL should have been. And guys with the talent of Kobe and Lebron are forced to attend college when they'd rather be playing professionally. And now the college ranks are having to deal with the issues of players like OJ Mayo and Derrick Rose when they should have been in the NBA or NBDL to start with.

Wall apparently was considering declaring, as you can (somehow) make an argument that he meets the requirements to declare.

You may think the rule is a farce (and I am not sure I disagree) but if the ruling on Clarett/Williams applies (and it would seem to) then the rule has essentially already been challenged and upheld.

The NFL did have a favorable ruling, but I would guess Walls' condition is special since he's a fifth year senior. It was definitely a gray area that the NBA would have to research further. Though I doubt it comes to it as Wall is likely headed to college.

More than likely - he missed the deadline to declare for the draft, so his choices are Kentucky or Europe.

EDIT: Wall's situation as a 5th year senior is hardly unique. Lots of guys go to prep school to get their academics right for eligibility. The NCAA considers that still being in high school. The NBA has never had to answer the question about what they consider it.

I realize the NBA declaration is over, but as we saw last year there's always the option to go over seas, prep school?, sit out a year, etc. Hence the "likely headed to college".

Wall's situation is unique given his lottery talent and the limited number of drafts since the age restriction was started. Most players who attend prep for an extra year don't normally have the talent of a player like Wall. Wall was a fifth year senior who was 19 years of age. The NBA rules for the draft are basically that the player is at least 19 and at least one season must elapse from the player's graduation of high school (or the graduation of the class from which he would have graduated if he did not get a degree). The gray area is the graduation year of his class. Being a fifth year senior means his graduating class should have been last year and hence the gray area. It's all moot now of course, but he certainly would have had a case to present had he declared. Even an NBA spokesman noted in Ford's article that they would have had to research Wall's case further because of the special situation.

Unbelievably stupid move, but you can expect nothing less from the NCAA. They've implemented the 'Tiller' rule that allows the opposing coach to choose the FT shooter from the players on the court when an injury occurs..........

NCAA changes rule in wake of University of Missouri Tigers' win over Marquette Golden Eagles in NCAA Tournament - STLtoday.com

The NCAA has plenty of stupid rules but this isn't one of them. I don't remember that play, but I remember other situations where a player appeared to be feigning injury to their advantage. This eliminates that possibility and seems like a good rule change.

Yeah, I'm on board with it.

As mentioned before, this rule allows the possibility for an opposing coach to foul a player who he knows is already injured and then select a bad free throw shooter to shoot game changing free throws. It also allows the opportunity for a coach to put in a 'goon' to hack a player on the arms hard enough to cause a potential injury, forcing a new player to shoot. It was hoped that the NCAA wouldn't adopt this form of the rule, but they unfortunately have done just that. It'll only take one stupid act this year to force this rule to be changed back. I just hope that player doesn't end up with a permanent injury that affects their career.

So it is your contention that coaches will start having players intentionally injured to take advantage of this rule?

I have a hard time believing that - and if it were true, there are in-game mechanisms (i.e. Techinical/Flagrant fouls) that are designed to counteract any benefit gained from such behavior.

What exactly is stupid about it?

Your scenario of someone hitting a player hard enough to intentionally injure them just so they get to pick the shooter would result in:

1) Two free throws AND the ball for the injured team.
2) The fouling player being ejected.
3) Sanctions against the coach (suspension) and school (fine) the second time it happens.

Fouling to injure is just not going to be a viable strategy. Lacking that, what's the downside?

You do know that this has been discussed for quite some time because of guys exaggerating injury right? The world does not revolve around Missouri basketball.

The complaints from Marquette shortly after the game was what triggered this discussion. I'd love to know why that happened because, as you mentioned, this has been discussed for years. Why was it suddenly a priority to change it so quickly this season? Call it whatever you want........it's a brutal rule change.

I'm not doubting that this is what put it over the edge...that's how bad that game ending was. I'm just saying this isn't the first time it's been discussed.

As for your classification that it's brutal...can't say I see many people, anywhere, agreeing.

It was several pages back, but there was a discussion that had people on both side of it.

Funny I thought the fact their player stepped on the inbounds line was why Marquette lost that game. And of course everyone knows that Tiller (who was clutch the entire season) would have missed the free throws that Kim English (The FRESHMAN with a LOWER free throw percentage) made as the substitute. Of course the general public remembers these games about as well as they do in the Super Bowl where the Titans were one yard from "winning" the Super Bowl. (Convinently forgetting the fact that they were down 7 at the time. I guess McNair was going to go for 2) Mizzou led for basically the whole game and was winning during the free throw incident.

Jesus, I meant the reaction to the rule being applied...where did I say Marquette got screwed or Mizzou didn't deserve to win?

Calm yourself.

Actually you said "that's how bad that game ending was".

And hence my clarification. Go read the NBA playoff thread and the reaction to all the technicals, which, 95% of the time have been called correctly but people are still upset about it. This rule was called correctly, doesn't mean it was a good rule...which is why it was changed.

How long have you been waiting to go off on a tangent about public reaction to a Super Bowl from 9 years ago?

The argument whether the existing rule was a good one or not is a totally different topic. The new rule was a knee-jerk reaction without little foresight to the possible consequences. But that's par for the course for the NCAA, so no one should be surprised.

I just don't think the "consequences" are anywhere near the level you think they are. The number of instances where a player could actually be intentionally injured to exploit this rule is significantly, significantly less than any player being able to claim that they are hurt when they are smacked across the wrist without any malice or intent to injure.

We haven't even discussed the fact that, injury aside, the idea that the team that broke the rules (i.e. the offending team that fouled the player) is now in control of the selection of the shooter. That's even more ridiculous than the original rule allowing the coach of the team that was fouled to select the shooter. Neither is a great rule, but this is a step backwards rather than an improvement.

I use that as an example all the time because to this day I still hear talk radio/ESPN personalities say the Titans were a yard away from winning the Super Bowl. It was just my example of people talking out of their ass about an event they remember incorrectly. I have heard the Mizzou/Marquette game was decided by that play and that is flat out incorrect. (Obviously I am from St. Louis so probably hear this more often than you would)

Fair enough, sorry if I overreacted.

Kind of like how Bill Buckner lost the World Series for the Sox (it was tied at the time)?

You forget the part that the reason he stepped over the line was to pass to a teammate coming open, then stepped over when that player did not come open due to being held....

I don't know that your overeacted at all. No worries.

Your 2nd example is exactly right. Other examples: Bartman and the '85 World Series. I will probably be the only St. Louis Cardinal fan on here who will agree with MBBF on 1985. The missed call on first base didn't cause Jack Clark to drop the foul ball, Todd Worrell to self distruct, or John Tudor to pitch the worst game 7 possibly in the history of baseball.

I have been friends with a diehard Marquette fan for 20+ years. He refuses to call them the Eagles, still wearing Warriors attire. We watched the Paulding/Wade OT thriller in the tournament back about 8 years ago, he goes on and on about Doc Rivers, I refused to watch last year's game with him but believe me I never heard the end of the Tiller free throw substitution. I used to show him MBBF's posts with Golden Eagle and it cracked him up...

Not once I have ever heard the hold accusation. This one is new to me.

What's an injured player doing on the court in the first place? If the player is too injured to shoot free throws then they should be on the bench rather than on the court.

And as other posters have stated, there's plenty of reason (ejection, technical foul, etc) for a college coach to not send a 'goon' on the court to hack a player. Yes there's a chance the rule could be exploited, but there's no doubt that teams could exploit the previous rule so nothing is really lost from the change.

I do believe this rule is a bit of an overkill and like yourself don't like that the rule gives the opposing coach the choice of shooter. My take on the Tiller situation is that if he was too injured to shoot free throws then he should never been substituted back into the game immediately following the free throws. The fact is that after the Marquette game, Tiller was a 50% free throw shooter which means he was nowhere near as effective. So by the numbers, Missouri certainly gained an advantage placing a better free throw shooter at the line. It also shows that Tiller did truly tweak his injury, but you have to wonder could he have shot the free throws since he was able to continue playing after the foul shots were taken. Mike Anderson would have probably been able to avoid this situation had he simply kept Tiller out of the game for a few minutes. That's my only gripe with Anderson in this instance.

Tiller had an injury on that hand, but it wasn't bothering him until he was hacked on the shot. When Marquette fouled him, it turned a sprain into two completely torn ligaments, which he played with for the rest of the tourney. I'm surprised he even shot 50% after that. The previous rule made perfect sense in that instance. Had Tiller not been hurt on the play, he would have knocked those shots down. Since ligaments were torn on that play, the coach who's player was injured SHOULD have the right to put in a new player.

He was put back in for defensive purposes. He wasn't going to shoot the rest of that game under any circumstances. You don't need to be able to shoot to play defense. I'm surprised a basketball fan doesn't know that.

You weren't in my living room as I was jumping up and down screaming.

Its not on the ball, so most people (including the moronannouncers) missed it.

The game was really decided on the block/charge call with ~ a minute left. It was a 50/50 call, and whoever got it was likely to win the game.

Texas fans rejoice. James has withdrawn from the NBA Draft. Texas has got to be a top 5 preseason team. Glad Mizzou gets them at home.

A bit of bad news was released today...

BYU Head Coach Dave Rose was diagnoses with Pancreatic Cancer....There is no deadline on his return and he may potentially miss this upcoming season...

My Prayers are with him and his family.

I know that Tiller had a previous injury and that it worsened with the foul. The fact is that Tiller was healthy enough to play just seconds after the free throws were shot. If Tiller is healthy enough to be an active defender then he's healthy enough to shoot free throws. He wasn't going to be as accurate as he normally is, but he was certainly healthy enough to shoot the ball, play defense, etc or else Anderson would have never put him immediately back into the game. Anderson used the old system perfectly and won a close game with it. I guarantee most any other coach would do the same thing if their in a tight game.

As a Missouri fan, I would expect you to know how active Missouri's guards hands are in playing defense. If a hand injury can keep Tiller from shooting free throws then it would certainly keep him from playing the active Tiger defense that Anderson loves. And let's not forget that Tiller played against both Memphis and UConn following the injury even leading the Tigers with 23 points against Memphis. The injury certainly affected his free throw shooting (he shot 50% from the FT line for the rest of the tourney) and thus why Mike Anderson was smart enough to pull Tiller for English at the free throw line.

The Big 12 should have some very good teams next season with Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas, Kansas State, and Oklahoma State all doing well on the recruiting trail.

7 of the top 10 players in the conference return. That's a much better measure of conference strength. I'd put Mizzou in that mix instead of Kansas State as Frank Martin has has some issues figuring out how to get his team focused and playing on the same page. Regardless, the Big 12 will be very strong this upcoming year.

Missouri loses a lot of interior scoring and rebounding with the losses of Lyons and Carrol hence why I think they'll struggle in 2009-2010. Anderson did a great job this season with a veteran squad, but you can't forget that Missouri under Anderson has struggled in the conference prior to last season. Anderson needs to start winning some recruiting battles and bringing top 100 talent into that program to keep up with the rest of the Big 12. KSU on the other hand was a 9-7 team last season and they return their top scorers (Clemente and Pullen) and add some much needed skills inside with freshman Wally Judge. Frank Martin is a young coach, but he has his players play some of the most physical defense in the Big 12. They struggle on offense at times, but their defense keeps them competitive and adding Wally Judge inside should help a lot.

Big 12 is doing a great job in recruiting some of the top talent in the nation with guys like Keith Gallon, Avery Bradley, Jordan Hamilton, Xavier Henry, Wally Judge, etc. I would consider last year's Big 12 a bit of a down year for the conference because of how young most teams were with so many NBA defections, but this year could be pretty strong with so many players returning plus so many highly regarded recruits.

I realize you're not aware of Mizzou's personnel, but Mizzou went 10-11 deep last year and has two good post players ready to step in. They may not be scorers like DeMarre and Leo, but they are better rebounders and defenders than those two guys, which works extremely well in the system. Outside of KU and maybe UT, there isn't any real dominant inside players in the league. Mizzou has plenty of scoring on the outside and in their transition game.

Recruiting is going very well for Mizzou. Mizzou brought in two very good players in this year's class who should contribute immediately. 2010 will be the big year for Mizzou recruiting with the Elite Eight bump already paying big dividends in that class. I'd be floored if we didn't get at least 2 top-100 players given the current interest list. Anderson is doing extremely well in Memphis now that Calipari is out of that area.

Previous years were tainted heavily by the total lack of talent left by the previous coaching staff. It had little to do with Anderson or his coaching abilities.

dola

Interview of Mike Anderson over the injured free throw shooter rule change. I really like his idea of giving the team the option to take the ball out rather than shoot the free throws if the player is injured.

The "take the ball out" idea could be abused as well, unless they make some changes. For example, if a team was down by two, and was fouled, they potentially could inbound the ball and shoot a three.

But they still have to make the shot and the defending team is still able to defend the play. That seems to be much better than the rule implemented.

FWIW, we'll likely see fewer big men on the court late in the game to avoid an issue with this rule. It'll be interesting to take stock after the season and see what effect the rule ends up having on the games.

You've got to be excited about your Horns with James coming back. They've got a ton of talent on the floor now.

Agreed. According to Rivals - Texas (3), Kansas (6), Oklahoma (7), Oklahoma State (11), Baylor (17) and Kansas State (18) are all in the top 20 for recruiting classes. That's pretty impressive.

Mizzou had some big losses and a pretty marginal recruiting class. Their best recruit is a 3-star PG who's rated #136 in the nation (#22 PG). They have 2 other 3-star guys unranked and a somewhat unknown final guy who's only offers were Missouri and James Madison. Compare that to Kansas State, who has a strong group back and added 3 top 120 players - including #18 Wally Judge. Heck, you can make an argument that Baylor with Jefferson, Dennis and McLaughlin (all top 100) might pass Mizzou this season.

This conference is going to be stacked with talent.

KSU and BU were supposed to do that LAST season. We all know how that turned out. As long as Martin and Drew are coaching those teams, they will continue to underachieve despite landing perceived good talent.

If Quin Snyder and Mike Anderson's stints have taught me anything, it's that the ability for sites like Rivals and Scout to accurately assess all talent in the nation is becoming increasingly difficult. People who work at those sites will openly admit that if you ask them. They rely more and more on second and third-hand reports because staffing is cut to keep expenses in check. Quin Snyder brought in highly-ranked talent according to the recruiting sites and couldn't do squat with it. Concensus amongst Mizzou fans is that Quin, along with Drew at Baylor, put far too much emphasis on rankings and just aren't that good at evaluating talent. It's fine to use it as a benchmark, but you can't rely on it.

I agree that the recruit rankings are a little "black magic", but it is all people have to go on at this point for the 08-09 class. I like Anderson a lot and think he will get the most out of the Mizzou team, I just think they need to get more talent in to seriously compete for a title in the Big 12 over the next few seasons.

I'd agree. UT and KU are the clear front-runners this coming year. All the other teams are just playing for one of the 4-5 NCAA tourney spots and a possible 1st round bye in the conference tourney.

Im one of the few who think that scouts do a lot better then coaches do when it comes to talent evaluation.

I have family members and friends who are Missouri fans so I catch a number of their games and know the roster pretty well. Missouri does go 10-11 deep, but they are still going to need a big who can score in the paint and right now they don't have anyone on their roster who has shown they can do that. As for outside scoring, there's potential there with guys like Tiller and English, but they still need to show they can do it over the course of the season instead of having one game where they score 20 followed by another where they score 5.

OU is adding one of the best big men in the country in Keith Gallon while KSU is adding one of the better power forwards in Judge. I think the Big 12 will have some pretty good big men in this conference next season and hopefully for the near future.

Missouri's recruiting is doing very well based on what? I'm certainly never going to say recruiting rankings are the end all be all, but they can normally give you a decent picture of what to expect. You'll have the occasional surprise boom or bust, but over the long haul the best teams are normally the teams that land the best recruits. Last year, Missouri took advantage of a very young conference with so many guys leaving for the NBA the year before. The Tigers were one of the most experienced teams in the conference and played well above what they showed the previous two seasons. But again, let's not forget that Mike Anderson in his first two years in the Big 12 finished 7-9 and 6-10. I need to see more than one good season before I start believing that Anderson's "system" can overcome quality talent at other Big 12 schools.

How is Anderson doing extremely well in Memphis since Calipari left? He hasn't landed anyone from there since Calipari left correct? As far as I know, Anderson has 0 commits for 2010 or 2011. Calipari will now just recruit those guys to Kentucky. Then you've still got to beat guys like Bruce Pearl or Kevin Stallings. I'm looking at Missouri's current recruiting list and

I saw Bob Huggins and Frank Martin take a completely putrid KSU program and turn it into a potential NCAA tourney team within a year. You're so quick to dog on Martin yet he had a better first two years at KSU then Anderson at Missouri. Then you've got Jeff Capel who took an extremely gutted program at OU and turn it into a winner by his second season. I understand that Quin Snyder was awful. But giving Mike Anderson a free pass for two years isn't realistic given the success of other new coaches recently hired into the Big 12. Anderson's a good coach, but he still has to prove himself in the Big 12 given that thus far he's had only one successful season. Heck, Quin Snyder had a successful season at Missouri, but I don't think you'll find anybody who said he was a good coach in the Big 12.

KSU was not expected to beat anybody last season with the losses of Bill Walker and Michael Beasley. KSU was actually rated eighth in the conference last season while MU was seventh. The fact KSU finished 9-7 without their two NBA draft picks from the season before should impress anyone. You may not like Frank Martin, but he has gotten his guys to play tough hard nosed basketball these last two years. I would expect KSU to again be in the top half of the Big 12 this year based on talent and coaching.

Quin Snyder could land quality talent. Quin's problem was that he couldn't coach that talent. Letting guys chuck threes all game long with zero semblance of a real offense will destroy any team. You can dismiss Snyder's coaching talent, but the guy could recruit. He recruited Leo Lyons, Ricky Paulding, Kareem Rush, Arhtur Johnson, and Linas Kleiza. Some of those guys are still making money in the NBA.

Drew's problem at Baylor was that like Quin, he lost control of his team last season. They had all the talent in the world, but they didn't play together at all until their backs were to the wall. Drew is a great recruiter, but he needs a good bench coach to help him with the x's and o's similar to what Missouri tried to do with Quin later in his career. In all fairness, I've heard good things about Quin Snyder coaching in the NBDL. I do think he's going to eventually be a good coach in college or the NBA, but he just wasn't ready for a head coaching gig when Missouri hired him.

Duke guard Elliot Williams is transferring home due to mother's illness. Leaves Duke really shorthanded at guard (only 2 returning guards). Looks like Memphis will probably be the destination. Missouri (HS teammate on team) and Vandy are outside possibilities.

Elliot Williams of Duke Blue Devils transferring for family reasons - ESPN

Oklahoma State loses a big recruit. Karron Johnson (#57 in the nation) has failed to qualify and will attending Moberly (Mo.) Junior College.

Man, this offseason has been crazy. Arizona just added two more USC decommits in 4-star PG Lamont Jones and 3-star PF Derrick Williams. That puts Arizona's 2009 haul since Miller was hired as 4-stars SF Solomon Hill, C Kyryl Natyazhko and Jones; with 3-star SF Kevin Parrom and Williams to round it out.

With these two new additions, Rivals.com posted that Arizona's class would be in the top 12 if they re-ranked. Given they had one no star JC kid in April (who they released when Miller joined), this is pretty amazing.

Hmmmmmm. I'm trying to figure out whether I want this to be true or not. The Lance Stephenson talking with Mizzou rumors are evidently true at some level, though no one is certain how much interest Mizzou's staff has in him. I've heard some nightmare stories from the AAU circuit about this guy's recruitment and eligibility. That doesn't even include the fact that he's a pretty self-centered player. But he's one of the top 5 players in the class of 2009. I'm glad someone other than me is making these decisions.

Rivals said it's between Florida International and Memphis. I know Arizona, St Johns and some others took themselves out of the running last month. IF Mizzou is interested, they would have a strong shot at landing him - but he doesn't seem like an Anderson-type of guy. I doubt they pursue him.

As an FYI, it came out last week that Arizona had zero interest in Stevenson throughout the entire process and the Stevenson camp was floating rumors to generate more interest. That may be what's going on with Mizzou now.

Tim Hardaway Jr, a 3* Guard, and obviously the son of Tim Hardaway of NBA fame, has committed to Michigan today. He for sure fits Beilein's type of player.

Potential recruiting change-of-heart on the airwaves in KC this morning. Carl Henry was interviewed by the morning show on a local KC radio station. He said that Xavier and CJ Henry are not yet sure they want to attend Kansas. They are reportedly going to put their heads together (code for crunching the $$$) and decide on whether they want to go to Kentucky or Kansas.

We were talking about Calipari just last week at work. You put a guy that dirty in a place with the huge wealth of resources and hungry admin willing to look the other way and they're going to test the death penalty limit (not that the NCAA would ever have the stones to do that to a major program).

Looks like we've seen the first glimpse of that.

SI

No question about it. It's pretty obvious what's happened here.

Lance Stephensen to Cincinnati.