Ok, that should cover anyone. Keep in mind that one role gets to know the role of whoever votes them first, so I suggest letting me do that with all of those people again Tomorrow.

Sorry about that!

Just got caught up, checking to se if I wanted to swap my vote over. No major reason to yet.

Looks like there are 15 roles in the game but only 13 players, so it's possible that role isn't in the game. We also might have to see if EF will allow those votes as valid without unvotes.

yeah, I feel the way he did that was a little sloppy. If he's the bad guy captain (which is the only one I think knows who they are yet) and wants coverage, that would make sense. He voted everyone but just "forgot" to unvote so they don;t count.

Why again tomorrow? Why waste two days of that role getting the same information twice? And besides, tomorrow, that role may be a bad guy and draft to the side of Nat, if it's in the game at all. Seems like a bad play from where I'm sitting for the village.

Yeah, that play makes no sense to me. Even if it's allowed which I massively doubt it is, you don't even know if you are a villager yet (or you know you aren't).

I also hope EF clarifies that rule otherwise it's a race to the bottom to vote everyone at the start of each day.

Talk me through this, I'm not sure I'm on the same page as to how useful it is

The one thing that is going to absolutely suck obviously is if we hit the seer with this

Best outcome is we hit the brutal who is the wolf captain. Hitting the neutral is probably useful to both teams.

Other than that, you are revealing a role without knowing their alignment which seems to have limited value. Although that being said, we probably can determine something from whether that player stays alive past day 2 or not, at least if it's a wolf harmful role. What else am I missing?

It's been a very long time since I've played so I want to make sure I have the rules right, so that my spreadsheet is accurate... so fontisian's vote for cheekimonk on post 101 counts and the rest are ignored because there was no unvote?

What did you need cleared up? Catching up and my have missed something.

Correct

I think in almost any situation, more information is good for the village. I particularly think since roles are not associated with alignment in this ruleset. If, as seems possible, everyone has a role in this game, then nailing down anybody will help whittle down false reveals. It will also mean we can force someone to prove alignment by using their role. Given that even the "seer" role is sometimes wrong, in my interpretation, even they are only partially useful, and mostly useful only if we can confirm their role. That's my thinking.

Oh thank you for correcting me!

Still got time to talk this through though!

So what do we got?

I mean, I get some folks getting forgetful with stuff, and fotnisian certainly may have as well, when she forgot the unvote part.

Shoot I forgot to have just one single post with a vote myself.

Hey, if you are voting for CR for "not reading the rules" then wouldn't that same logic work for others, like me? Or fontisian with the lack of the unvoting?

Might as well vote fontisian then.

Votes as of post #124:
3 JAG - Autumn (43), cheekimonk (56), Telle (81)
3 Chief Rum - The Jackel (53), mauchow (76), Julio Riddols (98)
2 fontisian - JAG (39), Abe Sargent (111)
1 tarcone - bhlloy (46)
1 Mauchow - tarcone (47)
1 Telle - Bitrock88 (61)
1 cheekimonk - fontisian (101)

Yet to vote: Chief Rum

This is what I was hoping to get cleared up, thanks

So about 35 minutes left in Day 0.. we have a tie vote and still missing one vote. Does it matter, given that today's vote is just a reveal?

Seems like we need to decide whether a reveal is valuable in general, if not I don't think there's too much harm in leaving it a tie. Worst case we might not get any reveal or a random reveal, something truly nasty like a double kill or something else untoward would seem unlikely at this early stage

I'd rather not have a tie. EF usually has nasty tiebreakers if I remember right. I'd feel a little bad piling on Chief since technically he should have a vote on me if he didn't botch his vote. Anyone else want to swing a different way? I don't really follow the logic of wanting me to be forced to reveal my role as a help to the village (if I end up on that side).

Given that so few players even have any idea as to what team we're on, I'd say it's pretty difficult for any of us to determine whether or not a reveal is good or bad in general.. and pretty impossible at this point to determine who is best to reveal. At this point everything is pretty much random for most everybody it seems.

What's the benefit of a tie? I'm not a werewolf history buff but it seems that ties favor wolves more often, no?

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Considering no roles have been given what's there to reveal at this point?

Well we'll learn the person's role, but not their alignment (unless they're a team leader, if I'm understanding correctly). I'm not entirely sure that's even useful information or will just be something of a distraction.

My last post was to jag who seems keen on revealing his role when there aren't any roles..? Unless I'm missing something.

Revealing before deadline, that is. I suck at posting on my phone..

Hm? I said I want to reveal?

I guess I can read it both ways.

Going afk for a bit. Pile on me if you must, please don't tie the vote though.

Hope that counts this time lol

And yea I know that ties it.

I figure if there is a vote to tie it on, this is the one.

Does 9:00 count?

Boooooooooo.

Does unvote and vote have to be separate?

How is this deadline? The dealine in the post reads 10 pm PST not EST

As long as the unvote and subsequent revote are the only things in the post it is okay.

Hah, may as well make my Reentry to WW one to piss you off :) jk.

VOTE MAUCHOW

Thank you.. I was struck by indecision regarding whether or not to change my vote to kill the tie.

That's only in the thread title. The rules post is clear and the start up post for today's action also says 10 p.m. EST

Well, better to win a Day 0 vote than a Day 1 vote I suppose.

Based on EagleFan's recent posts, it appears to have been a typo. But obviously people didn't know that and were relying on it being PST not EST. So I guess we'll see how EagleFan handles this...

I don't know that it was a good idea to not tie it this vote. This is a non-kill vote, i.e. low stakes. This was our one chance to find out the tie mechanism without someone's life on the line.

Tie mechanism for reveals vs tie mechanism for kills are likely different, I am not a dice roller in WW. Sorry bud!

And you're positive that the tie mechanism would be the same for a normal vote? And that he doesn't have a number of tie breaking mechanisms in his arsenal to toy with us with?

Unlikely, IMO. I doubt greatly the tie mechanism is different from this one to the next.

I could see a "growing tie" threat with multiple ties, but if we don't know what a tie does, we can't really assess that.

I didn't realize that I had the typo in the thread title. I apologize for that typo. I hope it didn't cause any major issues, I did state EST in the rules, if that is any help.

Who goes by that other coast's time, we use the real time here... :devil:

I don't think we've ever had a 10pm PST deadline.

Good call, Telle and mau.

Was hoping we could possibly reveal two characters with a tie.. Perhaps my assumption for that was wrong, but whether or not the mechanism was the same for night 0 vs other nights, I thought it would be useful to know 2 if there was a chance we could.

That said, JAG is Bud Bundy. Seems like a volatile character with his potential to change and develop abilities depending on alignment. Do we push a vote in that direction or try to press elsewhere and see what develops?

We need to learn what we can. I will hopefully have a clean internet connection tomorrow to try and get more involved, as it is one of my days off and therefore a chance to be awake during "business hours" for this game.

Nice writeup. It does seem in retrospect moving off the tie may have been a good idea?

JAG seems like a safe vote as he doesn't have a defined role (yet) from the description, but I don't think we should jump in that direction just yet. On the flipside, if he's a wolf and he's got the potential to develop powers, maybe we do want him out early.

I think I agree with where you are going with this Julio - prefer to see the day 1 voting develop without a single target, because it seems whenever we used to push a single person in the first few days that's when we'd end up on day 4 with no clue where to go next.

I'd rather press elsewhere.

If fontisian's failure to "unvote" and then "vote" everyone in order to trigger folks was due to forgetting or not remembering the rule from rust, then why not do it when she came back to the thread. That's odd to me.


For now, I'm not voting, I'm convince-able, and willing to look elsewhere if reason allows, and if there's something more to JAG than I am missing then I'm in and ready to push, but for now, I feel we have more pressing places to consider, you know?

On the flipside, if he's good, do we want to kill someone who could get better for us as time goes on?

Well, if the wolves are concerned about that then that decision might be taken out of our hands anyway. How long JAG stays alive probably is the main thing that comes out of a day 0 reveal, but no reason to look that way today.

True, although that was a piece of information ai think many of us suspected and I would have preferred to have kept out of teh thread in case the wolves hadn;t realized it. :)

I don't see the point in lynching JAG just because his role was revealed. Near as I can tell, no one knew their allegiance prior to the end of Day 0. So the Day 0 vote is largely meaningless, with respect to allegiance.

Just to clarify, I mean that since we were all "yet to be determined" for our allegiance, there is no way that information could have been in play for the Day 0 vote., so analyzing it for allegiance trends (or killing someone as a result of it, or to give votes on Day 0 meaning) is pointless.

Ugh, that's gross.

The point is to prevent the role from getting any information except my role, which I think is relatively unimportant. Looking over the available roles, I think that's one mafia would like to draft (?) whereas I wouldn't really bother with mine, which means limiting information to that role will probably be helpful.

Kind of too late though. Eh.

I look forward to people dying so I don't have to keep doing that.

Also, apologies to the person who has that role for destroying your utility, it's just that you're probably a wolf and you're not that useful for town.

Thank you. You guys already know I'm not Natalie Green (a guaranteed wolf role in the game), so statistically your odds of finding a wolf are better anywhere else if you have no other information to go on.

I agree with the thoughts about not going for JAG just yet. Keep that one in the back pocket and save it for later while we try and suss out some new information makes sense.

I think I need some help understanding these multi votes/unvotes. I don't recall it ever being a strategy in the past and I am curious as to why it seems to be one now. I don't have my mind made up either way about what I think about it personally just yet. Is it about trying to tell Col. Klink your role, font?

Why is that a good strategy?

Just want to know your reasoning.

Also unsure why the unvote/vote mechanism being used here seems to be either conveniently botched or just accidentally wrong.

For instance, you didn't put Vote in front of my name on your last post. That means you currently have no vote, or if the unvotes are invalid without a name attached, your vote is still on cheekimonk.

I don't think Font would intentionally botch that to try and pull a fast one (maybe she did on Day 0 because she didn't know what team she'd be on). Too easy to get called out on it. And I kind of like the logic of it, I agree it probably wouldn't be a great role to draft for team village, but could be helpful in targeting village roles as a wolf. I suppose I should vote / unvote the people she left out to be safe (not sure why she left some people out).