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I think the inuendos and hints and anecdotal thoughts can be dsicovered in any major program in the country. It just happens to be SC's turn in the barrel again. I read where Ohio State committed something like a thousand minor infractions in 2009 (okay maybe it was only hundreds), which tells me two things. First, the NCAA is completely out of control when it comes to unenforceable rules and second that every school struggles to keep from bending the vast majority of these silly regulations. I think the biggest problem the NCAA has with the Bush incident is that they don't have the "smoking gun" and they never will have it. If they can't nail down what exactly it was that Bush and family did or didn't do after 5 years of investigation, it's an extreme reach to assert that SC should have been able to see it coming and deal with it either. That's a wall that mitigates the circumstances in SC's favor that the NCAA just can't get over IMO. Not for lack of trying certainly. |
Friday is D-day for the slap on the wirst
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I wouldn't necessarily believe ESPN. I do think it will finally come this week, but my guess is that it will be on Thursday. |
I think Friday so they can skip out on the SEC and the media for the weekend
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I agree. The NCAA did the same thing to Alabama in 2002 (Friday announcement), and they just did it to UConn this past Friday. My understanding is that this is intentional; a normal PR move the NCAA does. The NCAA, from what I have seen, doesn't like to have to answer questions about its rulings. |
The first "rumors" are appearing
Probation: 5 year window with 3 active 17 over 3 scholarships 1 year bowl ban no TV ban If true it's basically the slap on the wrist like everyone thought |
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Do they have to vacate any wins or championships? |
I've heard complaints that say the NCAA can only investigate so much because they have no power once the athlete graduates - you can't force them to talk and you can't punish them if they lie. To get around that, why don't they make scholarship offers a legally binding contract with specific language around taking money from schools, agents, etc, with specific punishment. Then the NCAA could sue an athlete for breach of contract, force it into a real court system, and get answers (see Chris Webbers' "I'll lie to the NCAA but not federal court").
I don't really follow recruiting that much, so maybe this just isn't possible due to something I'm not thinking of. |
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seriously. |
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I'd imagine they'd vacate wins from 2 years and their Pac-10 Championships. The BCS title isn't governed by the NCAA so they can't do anything about that, but the BCS board can strip them of it, but they won't award it to someone else it will just go "unwon" for that year. |
There is noise out of USC that they haven't even received the report yet and that all of these experts who are guaranteeing the report is coming out tomorrow are going to look silly tomorrow when the report isn't announced.
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The fact that it has taken this long has already made the NCAA look silly
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I meant the Yahoo "writers" who are guaranteeing the report is coming out tomorrow and that USC is going to get hammered. Not to mention ESPN reporting that they know the report is coming out tomorrow. It could come out, but if so, Heritage Hall and Steven Sample have done an amazing job of shutting down all possible leaks and USC's Public Information Officer has denied that they have the report as of late this afternoon and USC has to be given the report at least 24 hours before it is made public. I think all of these rumors of what the punishment will be are just wild guesses, just like all of these guarantees about it being out tomorrow are. |
Hasn't Yahoo shown to be pretty spot-on with their college reporting? I'd argue that they are becoming one of the best journalistic sports sites on the web.
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Yahoo has credibility in the sports world, expect with USC fans. I believe they broke the UConn violations. THey broke the Bush case and Bush has since paid off both Michaels and Lake. I'd say they have been vindicated
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If what is being reported here is considered "hammered"... |
Why hasn't this thread title been edited yet?
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That's better.
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No, a yahoo writer wrote yesterday that he guarantees the report is coming out today (highly unlikely now) and that "USC is getting the worst penalty in decades, book it." Yahoo may have gotten a few things correct, but overall their sports "writers" are terrible. |
Well that writer should be out of a job.
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Same source as Norm Chow to USC :)
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It's like the Duke Nukem Forever of NCAA slaps on the wrist? SI |
A reliable writer on USC's site indicates that USC has gotten the report today and it should be made public on Wednesday. The report is supposedly 135 pages long.
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Or it could be a long explanation of everything they tried to prove but couldn't. Either way, they have to cover themselves. |
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Sounds like tomorrow, but like always I'll believe it when I see it:
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ESPN's source has to be the same as Mizzou's source
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True, but in this case, it looks like it will finally be done tomorrow. I have a bad feeling that neither USC fans nor USC haters are going to be happy. |
Reading a USC fan thread on another site I frequent, they are saying 30 schollies lost over 3 years and a 2 year bowl ban. No idea how true it is but it sounds brutal for USC if true.
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"So.....Texas, since you're coming here anyway, want our Rose Bowl bid? It's not like Arizona State really deserves it." |
ATVN Sports (No idea what that is but its affiliated with USC I think) tweets the following:
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Dola, apparently the school will release a press release as opposed to a press conference.
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Bruce Feldman tweeted USC gets a 2 year bowl ban and loss of schollies. We'll know for sure tomorrow.
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:D SI |
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So does that mean if they go undefeated and are clearly the best team in college football, they can't play in the BCS Championship Game? Or is it just non-Championship bowls? Just wondering if the Championship is considered a bowl. |
I'll wait until the NCAA or USC acknowledges it
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I never understood why "vacating of wins over the years" was considered a harsh penalty. Who really cares? What happened, happened. Michigan basketball had to essentially wipe out a few seasons because of the whole Fab Five mess, but other than joking about it, it really doesn't mean anything. Maybe if you stripped a team of a National Title, the fans would lose bragging rights or something, but vacating past wins, to me, seems like a really hollow punishment. The loss of scholarships and bowl bans going forward seems like a much bigger deal, since it has a real, as opposed to a pseudo-real, impact. |
The only time it's ever had any teeth, it's been fought tooth and nail but still seems to be sticking, at the moment. And that's when Bowden was forced to vacate FSU wins that probably cost him the career coaching wins record.
SI |
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I think the proper term that should be used is Postseason ban. |
Heh...from Detrich Riley's facebook (A kid who picked UCLA over USC after being a silent verbal to them for most of last year). It was a thread with George Uko, a Top 5 DT this past year.
FB status says "DAMN USC Trojans :( Im sorry to hear about the sanctions." George Uko responds (pardon the language): "fuk fufkf fukkkkkkk meeeeeee D nigga" DR says "its not too late to transfer bro i told you man. should've listened to me" Uko: "shuld culd of would of idk nigga im not trying to sit out a year" Good thing for Mr. Uko is that they'll likely be let out of their NLI's if true :) |
via Twitter:
 tribjazz If the reports are true, let me be the first to congratulate Colorado State on its improbable 2004 upset of Reggie Bush and USC. 8 minutes ago via web |
and:
tribjazz Oklahoma should hold its national championship parade along street in San Diego where Reggie Bush's family moved into $757,500 house. 3 minutes ago via web |
So, when they promote Reggie Bush now, will he be known as the Former, Former Heisman Trophy winner?
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We'll see what's in the report. My guess is at least McNair told the committee that he had some knowledge and that other coaches did as well. It's as close to a death sentence as we've seen for a major program since SMU, so there has got to be some bad stuff in there somewhere.
Assuming the above, I'm pretty sad and disillusioned about the whole affair. You do the crime, you do the time. |
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I cant imagine McNair would admit to that, I just find that hard to believe. With no possible jailtime for him if he is caught lying. That means the smoking gun was true (Micheals and Lake), so why not just pay off McNair? |
Then what is the violation? Considering FSU, Oklahoma and Alabama all got slaps on the wrist (2 of those programs were even on probation at the time). If the smoking gun isn't there a 2 year bowl ban and 20-30 scholarships isn't going to hold up.
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NCAA could have been gradnstanding and figured it would get thrown out in appeals and everyone would bitch at USC for getting away but the NCAA looks like it did its job?
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Seems like wishful thinking at this point, but we'll see tomorrow
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According to Fox News, Kiffin is meeting with the players in the morning to explain the penalties.
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Are you sure the players won't be explaining the penalties to him? |
Fair point.
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Blessing in disguise for FSU fans. Bowden had no reason to keep fighting for his job once that happened. And there were plenty of people (outside of FSU) who didn't want to include his Stamford years as part of his victory total anyway. I wasn't too torn up about it. |
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:D SI |
Can't take credit for this but I got a kick out of it.
Apparently the USC defections have begun:   |
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That was a university issue that involved non-athletes as well as athletes. If Florida State had stonewalled the NCAA nothing would have happened to them. #Fact |
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Maybe he can get Al Davis to explain it to them with an overhead projector. |
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Lack of institutional control? That has actually been the crime for some of the NCAA's harshest penalties in recent years. Granted these are still small potatoes compared what we'd see in the late 80s and 90s, but that's the catch all. |
The great thing is that with the scholarship losses, Kiffin has taken 7 WR's and 3 QB's in the last two classes
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what?? Mr great coach can't convert them all to OTs and LBs :lol: |
USC just got fucked. 2 year bowl ban, limited recruited contact and 10 schollies a year for three years.
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I'm really upset here.
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Also 4 years probation for USC. I wonder how Lane and Bebe will be able to get around that.
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That kind of punishment at a premier program must mean some bad shit went down.
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Lane Kiffin could turn out to be a great coach, but most fans (well everyone but USC fans) dont think Kiffin and O can go 4 years with probabtion. Thats more important then even a bowl ban
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So over the next three years USC will basically sign 45 scholarship players. That is brutal.
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They'll probably be able to spread them out over a few years. |
DanWetzel The 30 lost scholarships is an absolutely massive total. That's a behind the woodshed type punishment. Also, two year bowl ban
BryanDFischer USC Penalties: 4yr probation, vacate wins in bball in 09-10, 2yr bowl ban fball, w tennis vacate wins, fine of $5,000 BryanDFischer COI considered imposing TV bans but decided penalties were enough, decision was “a very tough call.” BryanDFischer Failure of USC was to recognize warning signs, b proactive in monitoring, didn't follow through on things, found lack of instit. control BryanDFischer OJ Mayo violations: received cash, electronic devices, services, meals, transportation and a TV BryanDFischer Case centered on agent and amateurism violations involving student athlete 1: (Reggie Bush) and student athlete 2 (OJ Mayo) BryanDFischer Reggie Bush violations: received a vehicle, rent free home for parents, airline tickets, hotel room, cash, limo, furniture, appliance. USC will DEFINITELY appeal this. This thing is harsh. |
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This was my initial reaction as well. But, to be clear (and I think Poli is in the same boat), I have no malice towards USC. But I LOVE seeing this happen to Kiffin. It's part of why I said (I think I said it here) that the move made no sense for him in my opinion. |
From ESPN
"The NCAA said its findings included "a lack of institutional control, impermissible inducements, extra benefits, exceeding coach staff limits, and unethical conduct by an assistant football coach."" Im guessing the Dogfighter got busted |
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Tennis team seems to fit in the "which one of these things is not like the other" game. |
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I am not sure. I am not sure on Pac 10 rules but the NCAA says you can sign 25 kids a class. If these 30 schollies are over 3 years, I don't see how they can spread it out. |
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I must have read it wrong. That is a harsh penalty. Basketball, Tennis, and Football means that the NCAA gave them the modern day death penalty |
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I know all these recruits right now are sticking with USC (2011 kids) but give these other coaches a week to negative recruit and they will be singing new tunes. |
I have nothing against USC, but I am glad to see that Reggie Bush (provided the findings are true) will likely have to vacate his Heisman Trophy. It seems like the athletes and/or coaches often get off without much of a penalty, but having to turn over the Heisman Trophy and possibly have the BCS come in and remove the BCS trophy (taking it away from him and all of his teammates on a championship team) has to hurt him a lot.
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30 scholies total, but loss of 10 off both the regular yearly 25 against the cap (75 instead of 85) for three years is going to HURT. Far closer to what set back Oklahoma for a decade than what happened to Bama. And USC basketball also received another 1 year ban for basketball |
So where does Seantrel end up?
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One aspect that makes this even tougher for ND is now there is no room for error with kids. They are going to not have typical USC classes as it is, but still probably decent but even in those loaded classes they had busts. Cannot afford that at all now.
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GO UCLA!
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Oh Dan :)
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I got a big blue truck now too, (a Ford and I've always been a Chevy guy) so maybe it's time to convert... |
If it's any consolation, at least the scholarship restrictions will have ended by the time that 8th grader is ready for college...
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Can the thread be edited to include Kiffin-hater chuckles as well?
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Yeah, I'm not sure who's happier about this news - UCLA fans or Tennessee fans. Is their home-and-home series concluded? Would have been funny to see all the anti-USC/Kiffin stuff between both of the fan bases next year.
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The home and home is done, but the opportunity may still come: they'll probably be in the same conference by 2020. :D |
Another reason to question the assistant football coach's credibility in denying that he knew agency partner A is the fact that the two shared a close relationship with a mutual friend ("mutual friend"), a comedian and actor who has appeared in various roles in television and motion pictures. Agency partner A grew up with the mutual friend in the OC. The record in the case included a photograph of the assistant football coach together with agency partners A and B and the mutual friend.
Todd McNair, Rodney Guillory and....anyone have any guesses? :) |
Will Ferrell is my guess.
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Will Ferrell was born and raised in Irvine, CA, right in the heart of the OC.
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Yes, I believe so :)
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Just saw that USC's scholarship limits do not count for last year. So with their 19 scholarships last year, you add, 15, 15, 15 for the next 3 years. That's actually a huge point in this. If USC sues, it could possibly delay when the punishment will occur and if USC loses that lawsuit, they could very well sit their program back 5 years |
BC makes it official; released a statement a short time ago....in accordance with the NCAA findings, USC's 2005 BCS championship has been vacated.
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BC? Bowl Committee? |
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Congratulations Oklahoma? |
What about Auburn?
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Hard to reward the undefeated team that wasn't invited to the game over the team that was, and was also undefeated, prior to playing what turned out to be an ineligible USC team. |
The speculation I had heard was that the title would be vacated and there would be no championship given out. No idea if the BCS has said otherwise today, though.
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Well, Fox Sports Detroit did a replay of a 2000 High School hockey game that was suspended in the 3rd because of a nasty injury to a player a month or two ago, so I say we get the 2004 Auburn and Oklahoma teams to kickoff this year's college football season at the Rose Bowl (where said game would have occurred) Minnesota wouldn't mind Peterson playing a meaningless exhibition, right? :popcorn: |
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Agreed, but it is also problematic to reward the team (OU) that lost in their bowl game over the team they should have played (Auburn) had USC been taken out of the equation instantaneously. But if you have to award one team now in the record books, then OU is the best bet I guess. Co Champs between OU and Auburn is better. But perhaps the best move is just having a *Title Vacated* next to the year. |
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