Blog feedback was running maybe 1/3rd with my general sentiment, although even more want to run Wren out of town ASAP for failing to accomplish much of anything this off-season (the Vazquez acquisition impressed a grand total of about, oh, nobody). I think in part some of those who were happy about the move was along the lines of "at least we did something". In the long run, I think Wren getting righteously pissed about this might be one of the more popular things he's accomplished so far.


Actually Wren confirmed today that the plan was to leave Escobar at short, move Furcal to second (which he allegedly agreed to enthusiastically if it meant coming back to Atlanta) and shift Kelly Johnson to LF, which he was also willing to do.

BaseballAmerica.com: Prospects: Prospect Diary: Non-Prospect Diary

Too long to paste here. Story about a practical joke played on a minor league player by teammates. Funny as hell.

Funny story, and pretty creative from his teammates.

Wow. From "He's going to sign, possibly tonight" to.. "We're Out of the Running"

From the Sox Owner, John Henry

"We met with Mr. Teixeira and were very much impressed with him. After hearing about his other offers, however, it seems clear that we are not going to be a factor."

(the rumored deal was 8-180).

Either they're playing real hardball, or someone's made a completely stupid offer.

Fairly mellow story on espn.com about the Furcal/Braves/Dodgers saga.

Basically the agent says we never had a deal, blah blah blah, and the story ends with "We hope that once emotions have subsided, the Braves will act in a manner consistent with not only their obligations under the collective bargaining agreement and the National Labor Relations Act, but also the best interests of the franchise," he said. "In short, we would not want this incident to color their better judgment."

The story doesn't mention what I have to figure the agent is referring to, which is John Scheurholz basically letting rip as emotionally as I can recall in his career. Hell, I can't ever remember anything even vaguely resembling something like this in his tenure.

Livid Schuerholz: Furcal dealings 'despicable' | ajc.com

John Schuerholz, the Braves’ president and former general manager, Thursday called the dealings of Furcal’s agents “despicable” and “disgusting” and said the franchise would no longer entertain signing players represented by them — ever. “Having been in this business for 40-some years, I’ve never seen anybody treated like that,” Schuerholz said. “The Atlanta Braves will no longer do business with that company — ever. I told [agent] Arn Tellem that we can’t trust them to be honest and forthright. I told him that in all my years, I’ve never seen any [agency] act in such a despicable manner.

“It was disgusting and unprofessional. We’re a proud organization, and we won’t allow ourselves to be treated that way. I advised Arn Tellem that whatever players he represents, just scratch us off the list. Take the name of the Atlanta Braves off their speed dial. They can deal with the other 29 clubs, and we’ll deal with the other hundred agents.”

Paul Kinzer, who works for Tellem and handled negotiations with Braves general manager Frank Wren, has not returned several messages left by the Journal-Constitution in recent days.

The Wasserman agency lists more than 60 baseball clients on its Web site, including the Braves’ Peter Moylan.

The Braves believed they had reached an agreement with Furcal on a three-year, $30 million contract with a fourth year vesting option. At Kinzer’s request, they faxed the agent a term sheet Tuesday morning for Furcal’s signature. A term sheet is considered the final step of negotiations. But Kinzer took the offer back to Los Angeles and used it as leverage.

Schuerholz said he phoned Tellem on Wednesday night.

“I expressed my great disappointment to him,” he said. “I watched as Frank shared with me the circumstances of his negotiations with Furcal — negotiations to the point where we increased our offer, and he [Kinzer] then asked for a signed term sheet to be sent over. We never got that signed term sheet faxed back to us, and we later found out why — because they took that offer and shopped it.”

Should make for an interesting visit Jul 31-Aug 2 and then almost immediately afterwards the return trip to the west coast on 8/6 thru 8/9.

For the record, I've followed the Dodgers as intently as the Braves since early childhood (I've told that story before, my late grandfather bled Dodger blue back to the Brooklyn days so I inherited a good bit of that I guess. To the extent that I've got a pair of stadium seats from the Dodger Stadium renovation sitting here in the basement). Point being, I'm not exactly in the position of being able to enjoy this nearly as much as I might if it involved any other team in baseball. But I find it very interesting, particularly from the standpoint of the Braves being one of the least passionate franchises in sports to suddenly seeing something like this. It's very out of character for them, which I think adds weight to their side of the story.

Yeah, I don't know quite yet what to make of that. All the talk around here are that the Angels are already looking hard at Plans B, C and D in anticipation of Teix signing with the Sox.

Aaahh.... Gardner, the "Furniture Capital of New England", or as anyone driving Route 2 calls it, the Speed Trap of Central Massachusetts.I heard we were up to 8/184 (23m/y). It sounds like another team has offered 8/200 - if it's the Yankees, we won't get him, but if it's Washington, this is just a negotiating ploy. Draw the line in the sand at 8/184 and if he wants to go to Washington over $2-3m more a year, good riddance.

8/200, that's just wrong. I decided in the last couple days that I thought $23 M was too much for Teix, much less $25 M.

Of course, I also think $18 M is way too much for Torii Hunter, but I wouldn't give him away for nothing.

All reports I have been hearing say that the Angels made their offer last week, and haven't budged from it. Tony Reagins calls it a "fair offer".

Which sounds like they made the same determination I did, and decided there was a line at which it wasn't worth it to go higher for Teix, and they are at that line (my guess has been about $22 M per).

I was hoping the Red Sox would draw the line at 20m per, but alongside JimGA's reasoning - it looks like another team is going even higher and bailing us out.

Either way, I love the new negotiating tactics with Boras - every team publicly announcing they're stopping at X point and pulling out. Makes it a little harder to bluff and play teams against themselves.

Interesting story about Kyle Davies. He actually works a construction job in the off-season to keep busy and in-shape.......

The retro jock: Royals pitcher has offseason job as a laborer - Kansas City Star

I dunno - I think the Sox ownership is going to take a lot of PR-flack if the let the Yanks get Sabathia/Burnett/Tex in one offseason and their biggest signing is...??

Yeah, they'll really have trouble selling seats next year.... I don't want to overestimate the Boston media, but outside the lunatic fringe (which, I suppose is the WEEI fanbase and many writers like Shaughnessy trying to rile them up) I think our relative dominance over the Yankees the past few years means we'll have to wait until at least 2 weeks into spring training before the fans start getting restless.


Also, in an ESPN article, a "baseball insider" is claiming the rumored 8/184 from the Sox "wasn't close" to the actual offer. Good.

oh i don't think they'll have trouble selling out next year - just that there will be some restless braying - 2 offseasons without a significant signing - while letting Manny go (which I agree with), and during that time your most significant piece added from outside the organization is Jason Bay (who i also really like?).

Look - the Rays are going to be better this year with more experience, the Yankees have added significant pieces (and if they add Tex that'd be even more pieces), so if the Red Sox do nothing to improve I honestly think they're looking at fighting it out for 2nd place in the division behind Yanks/Rays with whichever of those 2 teams isn't in first.

And saying "oh we're well positioned to pick up pieces during the season via trades" isn't really much comfort.

note: i'm not saying it's not smart business decisions, just that they may have trouble selling it to the pink-hats and the WEEI-fringe.

And frankly, it worries me. Who's providing protection for Ortiz in this lineup? And that's assuming Ortiz can return to something like his previous form. I love our rotation, but there are some significant holes in the lineup.

I loved that story :D

SI

Anyone have a world's smallest violin graphic?

SI

lol

Is Anaheim the team that is in the running for Tex?

Also, is it true that the recent spending spree by the Yankees have pissed off a lot of fans and taxpayers?

We get it. They're loaded. We all understand that. It's totally unfair that they can spend more than anyone else.

Do you know who else is loaded? Americans. How dare we complain about ANYTHING when there's so many people worse off than us. You bitch, and bitch, and bitch about your tiny market Royals when people are starving and would love to be able to even live in an American City (even one like Kansas City, that can't support an MLB team but maintains a bizarre sense of entitlement that they do, and any other fan who committed the sin of being born in a larger metro area simply should shut the hell up and have no opinions about anything, at least while the small market fans are suffering tragically).

I felt sorry for small market fans until I came in contact with more of them and saw how bitter and jealous they were.

And you're always the one that starts it - every time. It's a baseball thread, but if someone raises any opinion about anything other than the Royals, it's the same shit every time.

I'd be pretty annoyed if the Red Sox have a lower payroll next year. Even though I realize that it'd still be higher than many other teams. And even if it's lower, I'd still be glad that they're in a geographic position to have a payroll that gives them a tremendous margin of error to contend. And if it's be up to me, there would be far more substantial revenue sharing, or a salary cap (or floor). But there's not, and that ain't under my control. So I root for the team I've rooted for as long as I could remember. That's all I do. And I'm annoyed if a star player holds out in the middle of a pennant race, or if a rival gets a star player. If you could get over it, you'd be a lot happier.

No, it's not the opinion. It's the "oh, woe is me" opinion that we find so offensive. I know, you guys are jealous, too, that your older brother a couple hundred miles to the south can spend more cash than you. And it's kindof sad to the outside world because, frankly, we all know you're better at it than them.

I mean, it's awful that all you can get for "major" moves is Jason Bay. You know, a guy who is fairly comparable to someone Oakland is gambling their whole season (and maybe more, depending on how the pieces they give up turn out) on this upcoming year in Holliday.

So, I'm not exactly going to apologize for your fan base lamenting you can't make tons of moves that other franchises hinge their future on. That just makes you spoiled rich kids and offended when people call you on it.


Yes, America! Apple Pie! Chevrolet-- hmm... maybe not at the moment. They're a bit third rail, what with the bailout and all. Can we have a mention of the Statue of Liberty, McDonalds, and 9/11 while we're at it?

Yes, we're jealous. We want a fair system. But apparently that makes us have a "bizarre sense of entitlement".

SI

SI - my point was that if that was the biggest move that we make then we're losing ground on the Rays & Yankees. My frustration was more that we haven't made any moves to improve the team, which is perfectly reasonable.

Can we just say y'all (includes me) are annoying in your own specific ways? ;)

No, I get it- I actually meant to include a smiley in that post but forgot.

That said, I think you'll still be fine just because, again, you're still much better at spending than the Yankees and I just think Tampa takes a step back next year. Toronto's now 1 significant piece worse than last year and Baltimore is still Baltimore (re: pitching).

This seems like deja vu of 2007 and how the Rockies were the up and comer that will be there for the next 5 years because they had young guys and that improvement would offset a large portion of the luck that got them there.

Now, I'm not saying the Rays are going to fall off a cliff but the level of competition is steeper when you compete with the Red Sox and Yankees for 1/4 of your season. Also, there was a lot of spit and bubble gum holding together that lineup: Bartlett, Aybar, Floyd, Gross- all getting significant playing time. And that bullpen gets a lot more suspect with Percival a year older and Price moving to the rotation.

In short, I think you guys are fine- I wish I had to worry about protecting my #4 hitter with "only" Youkilis, Bay, and Drew batting around him ;)

SI

I'm a Brewer fan. I should be annoyed. There was no way we were going to compete with the Yankees' bid for CC Sabathia.

Am I annoyed? Not at all. I'm a small market fan, but even I get annoyed with the small market fans bitching about how it ain't fair.

The notion that small market teams can't compete continues to be absurd.

i'm not even saying we NEED teixiera. in fact, reading a lot during FA i am becoming less convinced that they should spend ANY money on teixiera. but they definitely need to address the catching situation, and i'd love to see another solid arm brought in (peavy, or even derek lowe)

Same old thing.

Anything negative = "woe is me"
Anything positive = arrogance (as if we have anything to do with the success or failure of any team).

Aren't the Royals going to be pushing $70 million in payroll next year? Your whining must be pretty offensive to Marlins/Rays/Pirates fans. Well probably not Rays fans.

It is nice to be a fan of a team that can be counted on to play meaningful games in September (that's the "arrogance" part).

Expectations are relative. For the Celtics, anything less than a championship would be a disappointment. For the Red Sox, not making the playoffs would be a bad season. For Syracuse Football, I'd be thrilled with 3-4 wins next year. My expectations for Syracuse just aren't in line with those of Texas or Florida fans. That's life. I don't think Texas/Florida fans are assholes for being disappointed if they don't go to a BCS bowl. The Royals, in a weak division, have the opportunity to contend for the playoffs if they ever got their shit together. That would be extremely exciting for Royals fans. Root for that. Don't be bitter if teams with geographic advantages have higher expectations, and thus different thresholds for disappointment.

Yup.

I actually wish the Red Sox and Angels would walk away from the table. I, too, am thinking the price has gone way past his actual value to the team (in baseball dollars). So I don't want the Angels to spend the money--but I don't want to hand him to the Red Sox either, even at that bloated price, because that just makes them even tougher to beat.

I almost want to just start Wood and Rodriguez at SS or 3B, stick Rivera in LF, promote Morales to play 1B, and then go sign a vet bat to be a DH, and vet starter to be the fifth starter. We can even move Figgy to the Cubs for salary maneuverability. We can probably still win the AL West with that lineup.

But it's not about division championships anymore, and that's the problem. Been there, done that. Angels' management and fans want more. And I'm not sure that team could do any better in the postseason than last year's team.

In another event that can only somehow be the fault of asshole Red Sox fans, the Angels apparently withdraw their offer for Teixeira.....

Hopefully this brings his value back to something a little more sane.

(sterlingice surely feels this post is out of line somehow, and it goes against his strict rules about what is acceptable posting material for this thread - not quite sure if this falls under arrogance or "woe is me", but I'm making it anyway)

ESPN - Source: Los Angeles Angels pull out of Mark Teixeira sweepstakes

Not the fault of asshole Red Sox fans. But that doesn't mean they're not assholes. ;)

After spending much of the offseason wanting Teix back, I am now quite happy with this. He isn't worth this, and, like the Angels, I think they were being used as a pawn to drive his price up. I am torn a little now on where he ends up, because I don't want him to go to Red Sox unless they pay an arm and a leg to get him, but I would actually enjoy watching Boras swing in the wind as the price falls drastically on his top client, because he played it like an ass.

Tough to know who to root for? Boras or asshole Red Sox fans? Hmm...

I hope the Nats somehow sign him for 8 years, $160 M.

I know we have tons of Reds fans here, so let me ask you about a rumor from Gammons.

He says a three-way deal has been tossed around that would have the Angels send Figgins to the White Sox, Jermaine Dye to the Reds, and Joey Votto to the Angels. It doesn't sound like a deal I would do as the Reds, given Vottos' age and ability and contract, so I am wondering if you can provide me with the why. Do the Reds have some other super prospect a la that OF (forget his name, the 2007 Minor League Player of the Year who hit 20 HRs or whatever last year) waiting to take over 1B, and a hole to fill in RF? Or is this to replace Dunn? I don't know, seems like a little of mixing for no purpose, so I doubt it's true (unless the Angels are trading a good prospect as well straight to the Reds).

:eek:

Wow... what news. You have to wonder what Teixiera is thinking now of Boras' techniques. Watch, he'll end up with the O's ;).

The O's actually make the most sense.

It has to be BS. Dusty is a moron, but Jocketty has to be too smart to trade Votto for Jermaine Dye. Votto was .297/.368/.506 last year in his first full MLB season. Ideally you'd like more HRs from a 1b, but Votto will likely move to the OF in 2010 if Yonder Alonso stays on track as Alonso can't play anywhere but first.

Votto is a good player that should get you more than a 36 yr. outfielder. If you guys end up with him I'll throw this out now, "Fuck you and your competent GM."

I would love to see Boras cost his client money here....It's taken the owners years to figure out his bullshit, but perhaps they're finally coming around.

Same with Manny, who appears to be looking at less guaranteed money than he would have got with Boston via option years if he wasn't such a jackass.

I'm not sure how this could possibly be construed of being a post made from the angle of "asshole" :rolleyes:

SI

In not all-too-surprising news, the Yankees have signed Teixeira. 8 years over 170, full no-trade.

ESPN - Source: Mark Teixeira, New York Yankees agree to 8-year deal

They now have the four highest paid players in baseball.

And $115M in 5 players.

If they some how finish third again, I will laugh my fucking ass off ;)

Had the feeling that this was how it would turn out.

The smaller market AL teams should be happy with this. The Yankees could still very likely choke, and at least now most of the talent is concentrated on one team.

Not to mention the extra luxury tax they'll pocket. The luxury tax bill could be high enough to subsidize three or four of the smallest market teams.

actually, even with the moves they made, they won't be paying much more this year then last. They were dropping off like $80 million in payroll this year

I have a hard time believing Cashman was the guy pushing for these signings. Why in the hell did he sign an extension with them when more than half the teams in the league would have killed to get him and let him run the team as he wants?

Because it's the Yankees?

For all the pressure, it probably still is one of the more prestigious positions in sports.

Maybe its just me, but I've never seen GM of the Yankees as a prestigious position considering your hands are tied and a group of people in Tampa that know as much about baseball as my wife are calling the shots for the most part.

According to the ESPN article:


That's freaking amazing.

blah. i didn't want Tex that badly at the price he wanted, but not excited to see him on the NYY

As part of his last contract negotiation, he got authority over the Tampa people. Of course, that came when George was still alive and in control, so who knows what the story is now that Hank is the #1.


What's amazing? That the payroll isn't really going up, or how little talent came off the roster for $80 million :)?

I think this offseason shows that there's, at the very least, a power struggle. The Teixeira deal is probably the most obvious Cashman deal, Sabathia could be, but I can't see Cashman going for Burnett.

Both (though they tie in together).