I hate to lose three villagers, but I'm glad to see that I was right about Lathum. However, I was way off on saldana and st.cronin. Back to the drawing board I go.

I'm not so sure about this. There are 17 folks left. On the light side, we have townsfolk and rangers. The victory conditions for these 2 groups don't depend on the other being eliminated, so we can work together.

I'm trying to figure out how many good people are left and how many bad people are left. I think I lack the experience in these big games to know how many folks there were for each dark faftion at the start of the game. I'm thinking it is possibly 3 a piece with the abilty to convert.

So, looking a starting postions, I think we still have an 11-5 advantage. The problem is with the multiple kills per night. We need to figure out who's who at this point. I don't think it is a bad idea for the seer to start letting us know what they've found especially if they know who is a bad guy.

Could someone with more experience in the big games give their opinion on how many dark side folks there might be at this point?

I don't see any reason to change the vote I made yesterday, so I am going to stick with that. Let's get the ball rolling.

VOTE Tyrith

I actually was starting to distrust St.Cronin based mainly on him still being around. He was an active player without any lynching heat on him trying to drive people to logical methods of voting (whether you agreed with his logic or not, he applied a very detailed and thought out reasons for why he felt we should do what they are doing.)

That is the exact type of player that I would expect to be night killed, so if he was still around much longer I likely would have started to get suspicious of him.

Now that we know what we do about the day 2 vote between Lathum and Chief we know it was villager vs villager run off. Its pretty funny though that Tyrith predicted St.Cronin's death in a pool of blood last night.

I'm wondering if there is any value in looking at the people who have been hiding their votes somewhat. Something like Brian's voting pattern jumps out at me. Day one vote for Spleen (with late jump to Scoobz after he was already surely lynched), day 2 vote for Lathum and day 3 vote for Tyrith.

My guess is we started with 3 bad guys per team (or 2 + conversion ability) and 3 rangers (or 2 + conversion ability). I think we likely started with 2-3 neutral roles. That would leave roughly 12-14 villagers to start.

My guess was:

13 Villagers
3 Saruman (or 2+1)
3 Sauron (or 2+1)
3 Rangers (or 2+1)
3 Neutral.

THat would make the current numbers:

7 Villagers
2? Saruman (depending on what Scoobz was)
3 Sauron
3 Rangers
2 Neutral (or possibly 1 depending on what Scoobz was).

This is my best guess with the thinking that most likely any conversion possibilities there were have been used by now for most teams. There might be chances of multiple conversion chances on some timer however.

My thoughts exactly...im rather suprised neither bad army took a shot at who i figured they would, unless they were afraid of a block.

I know your dead, but i figured i would simply say you were 3rd behind sublime and izulde. You werent being accused like you think, just mentioned along with the other two. Im sorry you died, i was looking forward to playing with you a little longer.

I kinda thought that another would be targeted last night too. I am surprised both women made it through the night. in addition to Blade

Was it a sure lynch of Scoobz when I voted for him? I don't know the exact vote count (nor did I at the time), but I wanted to make sure we had a majority. Day 2 I thought Lathum was more suspicious than Chief Rum, and I still think Tyrith is suspicious.

I actually got st.cronin AND saldana with that one.

You were the last to vote for Scoobz (you made it 15), so we were already over the limit needed.

Well like I said, I wasn't counting that closely. You can believe me or not.

Yes, god damn me for being right when i openly stated i didnt think either chief or lathum were bad that day. It must make me evil for being right. Just a few hours ago you were accusing me of always being wrong with my votes, yet so far all thats been proven was i made the right move while you did not. But, despite the fact you are not my top suspect, here you are spinning the lynch away from you again in the bolded part.

Now, i could have totally agreed with you since it would make it easier to get sublime lynched with his voting record, but i felt this statement needed to be made as with the death of the 3 last night there is a much smaller group of players who are willing to stand up to you.

Yep, vote recap was posted at 8:32 saying there was 10 votes for Scoobz. You posted right after that so were in the thread responding to things. The 13th vote and lynching vote was made at 9pm, with another vote after that.

You voted the 15th vote, switching your vote 20 minutes after the 14th vote once it seemed a dead lock and on the same page with a previous vote count update stating how many votes Scoobz had.

Well, unfortunately we had a villager vs. villager runoff on day 2. So any bad guys who weren't trying to "hide in plain view" probably split and buried their votes.

Oh Good grief Blade, get over the persecuted act already. In the quote you posted, you can very clearly see I was refering to Brian's voting patterns and have followed it up with discussion on him. What in your mind could you possibly think that post had anything whatsoever to do with you?

Oh I forgot, every one of my posts is a subtle hint to try to get you lynched.

I'll take your word for it. I remember not knowing exactly what the situation was at the time and wanting to make sure we didn't come up short. If it was unnecessary and suspicious...so be it.

3 hours ago alan, read it..you cant tell me that i should ignore that post when you make other comments about who to vote for

Next time I will make sure to put more than one of these in a post where I am joking: :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

Give it a rest already, I very clearly said there that voting for you would only be out of spite because of posts of yours exactly like this.

The top one was a joke, the bottom one wasnt. I said sublime i my top target, but i think its become very clear the bad guys have adopted a kill the vets strategy(vocal vets at least). So when i look around, i dont see too many left...i see you, i see me...

There are other vets around, but they have been far quieter. So when i see all the "vocal" vets die except you and me, and i know im good, i cant trust you right now. Id rather have sublime lynched, but much like your reasoning you stated here for cronin, its hard for me to ignore you:

Thats fair enough, I have no problem if people want to be suspicious over my being around right now. As long as you're ready to go down that path with me.

I personally think its a waste as my top suspects right now are:

BrianD, Mr.Wednesday, Tyrith, Izulde, Schmidty

and my most UtR people I am considering right now are:

Swaggs, ntndeacon, Sublime

I have absolutely little trust in anyone right now, the only one I was starting to feel good about (Lathum) died last night. Before last night, my top two suspects were St.Cronin and Saldana.

Now if you want to make this entire day about you and me and ready to go to a lynch over it we can definitly do that. But right now I'm seeing this as an attempt to try to distract everyone from the points I am making about BrianD more than anything else.

I'm going to play devil's advocate for a second and go with the people blade has been talking about. Saldana, well, I've never liked him....oh, wait, you mean he's dead already? Aw. :P

Sublime 2 - Hasn't been on the lynched candidate either of the last two days. His posts generally seem to indicate he's just trying to do the right thing and he's a little overwhelmed right now....if this isn't setting off alarms in your head considering who is posting this, it should be. I pulled off this BS scheme before. The fact that he wasn't on the lynchee means we can't read his votes, so we don't know what side he's on. Would a more experienced bad guy help along with this plan? I certainly think it's possible. I started picking up a real bad vibe about Sublime yesterday because of the parallels with myself, so consider me suspicious.

Izulde - I really don't know. I read over his posts yesterday evening and didn't get anything too alarming...but now that I look again, the accusations do cause problems. I'm suspicious here too, but I don't have nearly as much to back it up. Sublime would come first if I were to vote between the two.

I'm still suspicious of most of the quieter people that have done middle-late votes on rum and kwhit...gram for sure, lsg, Mr.W (would be playing a really nice game because he's doing his best to make it seem like he's a team player), and Thomkal. And with Schmidty....well, he could be dropping hints he has a really big role, or there could be some nonsense going on.

Yes, when i said repeatedly sublime was my #1 and izulde is my #2 i want to force a lynch between the two of us. I swear, as hung up on you as you think i am, you really are hung up on me in your mind having no goal in this game but killing you. Its rather ironic how similar we feel the other player is playing us.

Oh, I forgot to talk about Brian. Yeah, I don't have a good read on him because I haven't played with too much, but he sure is good at acting suspicious in general. I wish we had some way to start a CoT at all instead of being on Day 4 running around like chickens with our heads cut off. NOTE: I am not advocating role reveals of critical people, don't accuse me of being a wolf for that :P

Alan, blade, unless you two want to screw us all FOR THE LOVE OF EVERYTHING STOP BICKERING.

The reasons for sublime are based on this game only...my reasons for izulde are heavily based upon the fact last time i saw him play, in which he was evil, i feel he played basically the exact same game. So take it for what you will, but no one can accuse me of not saying what im thinking

Oh, and now i have a 4th canidate, becuase they werent killed last night. If this person doesnt die tonight, they will go much further up my list.

Bad idea to give them this. Now they can screw with us if they can figure out who that person is (and I don't think it's going to be too hard).

Well to get back to the point i was -trying- to make before that intermission...

I do find your moves suspicious so far. The late meaningless move onto a bad guy, followed by the insistence the next day that no bad guys could possibly have known he was bad when in fact it hasn't been proved one way or another.

The next two days managing to stay off of the person being lynched (day 2 when it was villager vs villager) and yesterday when it was villager vs unknown are a little less suspicious, but just adds to what i saw on day 1.

In this game the bad guys don't necessarily know who all the other bad guys are, but they just know who isn't on their team.

The person did it to herself with comments made recently...i was going to let it slide for awhile, but comments made make me much more doubtful now.

Just to throw this out for discussion: Doesn't it make sense to keep you two around? Why not keep two vocal vets so that people will be suspicious of you?

For what it's worth, I think Alan is good. I still have reservations on you (mainly because of the first day), but you're not high on my list.

I got lynched!?!? Sheesh.

That was ummm... Not very smart.

I made a late vote switch that almost made a no-lynch. It was shown that the guy I very nearly saved (CR) was a good guy. Then why in the world would you guys lynch me? I figured I'd be closer to a circle of trust than a lynch victim.

Oh well. Ya'll have fun.

Watch the language

Gosh darn me, sorry

Alright, this is eventually going to get me lynched, but the new and improved list:

1.Sublime
2.Izulde
2.Thomkal

2 and 3 are tied for 2

4.?? is a ways back, and is now strongly tied to #2b

Yes I have played with you. Remember that beginner game? And that other one game I was in where I got night killed early, you may have been in that, too.

Okay, I might as well put my money where my mouth is and get this mess started.

VOTE SUBLIME 2

Well, since I still have my suspicions about LSG and her quietness and she was my initial vote yesterday.. and she suddenly can't remember that I've played with her before... on the block she goes.

VOTE LONESTARGIRL

Right now, ntndeacon is high on my list. On day 1 he voted for Swaggs. Day 2 he was the third vote for Lathum. And yesterday, after being called out by Alan, he started ranting about KWhit. At that time, KWhit only had three votes. It was shortly after that that the piling on KWhit began. ntndeacon didn't add his vote until he was number 8.

Stuff like forgetting that she had played with you before seems highly unlikely to be wolfish to me. A fact that can be easily checked is a bad choice of fact to try to pass off on the rest of us. I wish you'd come up with some other reason than her being quiet to suspect her because votes like this will set off alarms with most of the people in this game.

Amen, good grief it is getting ridiculous

Yup, I thought the same.

Izulde,

I've had my suspicions of LSG, too, but your actions yesterday smell fishy. You jumped on the KWhit bandwagon in the middle (fifth vote) and then pushed for saldana to keep his vote for KWhit instead of LSG. Why were you so eager to have KWhit lynched?

I was debating something similar. One of my thoughts was someone who voted for Lathum day 2, and once he fell out of the lynch spotlight went ahead and night killed him last night. My thinking is the Lathum kill was Saruman's "assassination" kill action and that once again drew me to thinking about people who wern't fond of killing Scoobz on night1.

This thinking is what actually led me to BrianD in looking at voting patterns this morning, but ntndeacon follows the same pattern. Day 1 Swaggs, day 2 Lathum. Mr. Wednesday also seems to fit the pattern some too. (which you can see where I based my immediate distrust list from.)

I voted ntndeacon yesterday due to him being super under the radar, and the fact he seems to fit in the profile that I can invision a bad guy in, I wouldn't have a problem voting for him again today. (That and the contribution he made after I voted for him yesterday was mostly rehashing already stated arguements).

Although I am very suspicous about Izulde, I agree with where everybody is going about sublime. So for the sake of lynch, if sublime needs an extra push to make sure he dies today, ill switch my vote... but not until closer to 10

dola, ignore the first quote by blade. I was going to make a reply to blade earlier and started multi-quoting stuff and decided it would be childish for me to do that and stopped. I didn't clear out all of my multiquote buffer. only the last quote is applicable to this post.

I believe that both Blade and Alant are good, they are bickering like they usually do, just more heatidly. On the other side of the spectrum, the people that i really think are wolves are

1. izulde
2. sublime
3. BrianD

Everybody else im in the middle with.... hopefully by putting pressure on izulde and sublime we will find out a lot today.

I'll go ahead and put the vote out I guess. I'll go with yesterday's vote for ntndeacon then.

Vote Ntndeacon

VOTE ntndeacon

I'm hoping this puts some pressure on him so we can see how he responds.

Because I'm of the belief that it's better to have a lynch than no lynch and because by my own reasoning of LSG's quietness, KWhit had been the same too. Besides, other people mentioned some voting oddity.

Do you know what the voting oddity was?

I'm largely going based off my past experiences with her and a strong hunch. Could I be wrong? Possibly. But based on the current situation, I'm pretty darned certain she's bad.

Switching off on to someone else after the lynch had been assured. I want to say it was the Chief Rum vote, but I know it was one of the votes.

So you were pushing for a lynch for someone based on a voting oddity that you weren't sure of? Seems odd to me.

I wouldn't say I wasn't sure of it.

Rather, I knew the voting oddity occurred and the shape of it.. and I remembered that it happened on a lynch that turned out to be good.

Jonathan, izulde is picking at straws.

That is a flat lie. I never insisted any such thing. By reading the death notice, I said that is looked likely that he wasn't on either bad team. That is it. You can find a reason to vote for me, but don't make one up.


Not managed to stay off the person being lynched, being outvoted. Slight difference there.


No argument here.

I would hate for facts to get in the way of a good story and all, but I already spent about an hour looking through posts to find which people I felt fit a certain profile. Right now the ones that stood out to me most were you, Mr.Wednesday and Ntndeacon.

Below are the posts from you on the subject, I did not include the interplay Mr.Wednesday had with you going back and forth, but to me you two sure did seem to easily conclude it was fact that bad guys didn't know Scoobz was on their team. It seemed awfully convienant for you two that would be the case considering your actions that day.

I am not so sure that some of the guys on the block now are bad candidates, but I am going in a different direction today. For me, this person is reminding me a lot of how I behaved the first couple of times I was a werewolf.

Vote Daddy Torgo

I've nailed a few people this way before, so I'm going my own way today, just based on WW experience.

I don't think you at all proved what you were trying to. You have also said:
From the death notice, and knowing that we get full faction reveals on death, it looks to me like Scoobz wasn't on either bad team. Seems like a logical conclusion that if he wasn't on either bad team and the bad guys know only who is on their team (which you suggest and is reasonable), then the bad guys wouldn't have known that Scoobz was bad.

I'm not positive that this is the case, but basic reading comprehension sure seems to imply it.

You can argue the fact whether or not people knew of Scoobz' affiliation before his death or not. However saying that I am lying about you making that arguement when you fully admit it now doesn't fly :)

There is a very big difference between the way Scoobz was posted and Sndvls who was an independant was posted. I was looking for someone who seem as a possible tie to Lathum's death plus some tie to Scoobz' vote with voting irregularity and the three matches I found were you, Mr.W and Ntndeacon.

The interplay between you and Mr.W as the ones pushing that Scoobz was not known now looks fishier to me than it did when you all did it. Until I see another dead bad guy with a faction listed as Saruman or sauron, I will believe that unaffiliated roles will be listed like Sndvls was and not like Scoobz was.

Just to clarify, you do know this is my first game right? Therefore, your reasons couldn't be based on any other game. And unless I missed it, I have yet to hear your reasoning for your suspicion. It's tough to defend myself against vague suspicion lists, atleast Tyrith tried to bring some reason to it.



I'll admit, this may have been a bad game for me to get start my WW career, due to the size and the complexity, BUT I assure you it's 100% pure overwhelmed behavior. I find myself, reading then re-reading posts just to make sure I'm understanding exactly what the person meant. But I still atleast can understand where your suspicion comes from, you've tried the overwhelmed schtick before, it's Blade, and to a lesser extent LSG who I haven't seen much from in the form of reasoning.

It may get you lynched sooner than you expect. I am a villager as I've said all along. I think the only reason you have me on that list is because I find it suspicious you weren't killed last night when you yourself expected it. I've thought since the beginning you were a fellow villager, but now I'm really beginning to have my doubts. You were wrong about saldana on your previous list, and you are wrong about me. So I don't think we should be trusting your instincts right now.

Im not the death you suspected that worries me about you

Well, I just spent a good chunk of time looking through posts and my head is starting to hurt. A couple of people jump out at me.

I filtered my spreadsheet to people who voted for both CR and Kwhit (both known good) and throwaway votes on Day 1 (I'm still of the belief that Day 1 DOES mean something), and the following match:

Mr. W (voted for spleen on Day 1)
Schmidty (voted for fouts Day 1)

I like Schmidty and all, but like JE mentioned, after Schmidty said he had an important role and is still alive (in spite of 3 deaths last night), I'm starting to suspect him more.

Vote Schmidty

I get the paranoia when AlanT mentions your name, but I also think that your wittiness is deflecting attention away from yourself.

I really, really don't like this vote. The wolves could very well have left schmidty live because they feared he would be guarded and/or someone hoped someone would do exactly this. Furthermore, one of the deaths last night was something the bad guys couldn't have known anything about barring a role scanning ability. This is really fishy to me.

I don't now what you are getting at here other than trying to make stuff up. You attributed to me the statement that "There is no way the bad guys could have possibly known he was bad". I never said that. I said they probably didn't know he was bad. You are trying to claim that I have perfect knowledge of what the bad guys do and don't know. I don't. I was just tryign to figure out stuff like everyone else.



There is a difference, probably because their status was different. According to the rules:

This clearly implies that there will be some neither light nor dark..like SnDvls.

Also from the rules:

These lines tell me that there can also be light or dark who aren't members of a faction...like Scoobz. It also tells me that "faction affiliation...are revealed upon death"


So basically you aren't saying that I am wrong, you are saying the rules are wrong. Even though the rules say faction affiliation will be revealed on death, you are pushing the position that my believing that factions will be revealed upon death makes me bad.

Is that really the argument you want to make?

Another wasted vote.

Part of the reason I'm still alive is because of my role.

Quite honestly, I don't fear the lynch. I do, however, fear what losing me would mean to Bree. All I want to do is help the townsfolk.

That's all I'm going to say about it. If you aren't going to believe me, you're not going believe me.

You thought you might be killed last night, and gave a list of people that you thought were evil. So why shouldn't I be surprised you are still alive?

Fishy? Why would it be fishy? Like I said, I filtered my spreadsheet and Schmidty and Mr. W voted for different people other than Scoobz who was a known baddie.

I can easily switch my vote to Mr. W since he met the criteria as well.

You shouldnt be suprised, thats one of the perks of my play style. Wolves tend to leave me alone at night since they think ill be lynched soon enough. But if you somehow think, with how i acted on day 1, ive made it this far without being scanned your simply not thinking clearly. If im bad you will know whenever the seer comes forward.

But again, it doesnt sound like your listening. I said i was not my suspected death that worried me about you, it was your comments about schmidty

My usual wolf strategy is to try to play as much like my non-wolf game as possible. It's great for nobody suspecting I'm a wolf, but not so good for managing the game to get a win. :-/

I might very well have voted (and argued) exactly as I have so far if I were on the side of darkness... so you're going to have to trust me when I tell you I'm a normal townsperson with the best interests of the people of Bree at heart.

You seem to be arguing semantics, I quoted the posts where you were telling people that you felt that bad guys wouldn't know Scoobz' role and you are arguing about things that I quoted you saying. You then go on to further argue the point that I am saying that you are arguing in the first place :confused:


Of course the rules aren't wrong, and I still have reason to believe that everything isn't as cut and dry as you and Mr.Wednesday seemed to make them out to be (especially since making them out that cut and dry benefit you and Mr.Wednesday the most).

Uhh... wtf was that? I had this stuff quoted because I was looking at swaggs posts because he's another one I suspect.

Oh well, whatever. I suspect Swaggs as well because he's been utr and seems to be playing the same kind of game he did in the SAW game when he ended up being evil.

Izulde, well, he's a different story.

Gosh darnit, I get so easily swayed.

Unvote Schmidty
Vote Mr. Wednesday

They both meet the criteria, I'll give Schmidty the benefit of the doubt.

I haven't eaten so I gotta get my grub on... be back in a few.

lol... well I was reading it and figured something like that happened. Looks like your thought process was trying to find a link between Swaggs and me. :)

I can easily say I have no link with Swaggs this game and I doubt he knows anything about me other than what I said in the thread. I would love to hear more of his thoughts on Daddy Torgo, but as of right now I think he's probably barking up the wrong tree. Inn keeping along with that general line of thinking, I would love for him to be a bit more involved so we have more to base our thoughts and opinions on.

I concluded it independently of anyone else, and I don't think Brian was even the most prominent in agreeing with my. Tyrith did as well.

So far, the only logic you've offered for the opposing position is some LOTR-theme gobbledygook. Convince me I'm wrong: since the dark adept is clearly NOT in a particular faction (Anxiety has clearly stated that factions are revealed upon death), why do the bad guys know who the dark adept was?

How am I supposed to know what the bad guys knew?? If you and BrianD are sure that you all didn't know who Scoobz was before hand, then fine I'll admit that one of the bad guy's sides didn't know him!

Seriously though, like I said before I based my suspect list on those who voted Lathum day 2 and had weird votes on day 1 involving Scoobz. The whole knowing or not knowing about Scoobz was something interesting I picked up along the way. I still won't be suprised to find out that you guys knew ahead of time.

Do you really think I am arguing semantics, or is that just the current game you are playing? You have been characterizing my posts in a very specific way. I'll quote you again:


I never insisted any such thing, and claiming that I did is like saying that I must be bad because I know what the bad guys are thinkin. You also say that I am stating something as fact when it hasn't been proven yet. What I was doing was trying to have the discussion which might lead to a general understanding of what was going on with the death reports. I didn't "know" I was right, but based on the rules as written, I thought my ideas were worth adding to the discussion.



Actually, I am just trying to help everyone out. I have no idea what Mr.Wed is doing, but I would guess the same thing. The rules seem pretty straightforward. They say that factions will be revealed upon death. If we have someone without a faction revealed, I have to assume that he didn't have one. The rules are also very clear that there will be independent folks, and those with their own victory conditions. You are insisting that we can't actually believe the rules. I am trying to clarify things, why are you trying to make them less clear?

So now you aren't really accusing us of what you were accusing us of, but we still probably knew anyway. Nice. :)

Thinking about day 1...it's possible, although I suspect not terribly likely, that scoobz was unaffiliated and they knew who he was. Something like the master/apprentice scenario from the sith game, where they could bring him to their side and knew his identify, but he was blind.

Alan, you scare me sometimes with your analysis, that's exactly what I thought.

If I knew for sure that you and/or Mr.W were bad, then I would come out and say: "I know you and/or Mr.W are bad!"

Obviously there was some tongue in cheek in my response to Mr.W but thats mostly because you all are arguing the side thought that I had which I found interesting rather than the reason I am suspicious of you.

I still feel there is some validity with lathum dying to what looks like a different killer than most of the normal night kills to look at who was voting for him during the day. I then narrowed it down further by seeing who had voting weirdness on day 1 involving someone who ended up a bad guy (whether you knew he was bad or not before hand). That narrowed the list down to three names. You, Mr.W and Ntndeacon (who I voted for yesterday and so far today).

Once I had that list narrowed down I spent an hour or so looking over the posts from that group. Of course I didn't find much from ntndeacon because he has been quieter than a stump. I saw the stuff from you and Mr.W and thought it was interesting enough to mention it and it added to my suspicions.

So from my viewpoint, you all are making a huge fuss over the part I found interesting and totally ignoring what put me in your direction in the first place (the ties to lathum)

That is one of my thoughts, but like I have said the entire game, until we know more well we won't know for sure. I just found it interesting when people were trying to push a certain idea or agenda when we don't really know the full story.

Why is this game so darn addicting? (BTW, I'm having a hard time keeping it clean).

Okay, i'm really gone now.

The fact that a seer hasn't come forward yet and mentioned you is what makes me think you are a villager as I'm sure you were an early scan target. I just don't like the fact that you pegged Saldana wrong, and now me.

And I was listening, I just misunderstood your post. :) Why shouldn't I have expected Schmidty to be a night-kill? He's the first one in this game to really reveal as a good-aligned role, and perhaps a powerful one at that. I suppose the bad guys might have thought he be guarded, but he might of been worth the risk too.

I just thought this needed to be discussed, as I'm sure I'm not the only one who had their suspicions raised.

Okay, I'm thinking we have better people to lynch than sublime for today. Mr.W, Brian, and Izulde have managed to ratchet up the list today.

UNVOTE SUBLIME

Is it really an agenda to say that I think this situation is detailed specifically in the rules?

There was even a question for Anxiety about the faction identifiers in the report and his only answer was that he thought it was quite clear (or something to that effect). Who has the agenda?

The fact he wasnt killed makes me think hes either bad or the bad guys want us to do it for them. Yourself and DC have been the two i noticed, maybe i missed others, who have tried to push suspicion on him. Thats in line with #2, but not #1...so who knows

You consider the CR lynch a good one?

I think the agenda is more the non-acceptance of possibilities that may lie within the rules but not spelled out by them. Tyrith mentioned one such possibility.

If you want to be suspicious of my moves, that is fine. I'm trying to knock out the bad guys, but you are allowed to see suspicion in my moves. The fact that you combined suspicion with the rules discussion seems like bad logic. The fact that you are now backing off and calling that discussion "interesting" doesn't change the fact that you used bad logic to throw a lot of heat my way. You have been trying to run things all game and you have used bad logic to point at me, Mr. Wed, and Blade. That makes me trust you very little.

My opinion on schmidty is that we have to let him go for today. Then if he's alive tomorrow we can torture him for a while, see what he says he actually is, then go from there. But today we'd be firing in the dark, and I have to think that the bad guys thought he might have been guarded if he's good.

You're misinterpreting my meaning. By good lynch I meant that CR turned out to be good.

I think you are trying not to hear me. Tyrith's possibility is definitely a possibility. That is why I have been saying things like the bad guys probably didn't know Scoobz was bad. They might have known. We haven't even really been discussing this. We've been talking about the faction of Scoobz. In the posts you quoted, I was coming to the belief that he wasn't in a faction. From what we've seen since those votes, I now strongly believe he wasn't in a faction.

I haven't used the rules to say anything about what the bad guys did or didn't know. I have used them to support my belief that Scoobz wasn't in a bad faction.

The fact that you link Tyrith's possibility with my discussion of the rules when they are not connected seems like an attempt to throw more suspicion on me. You are playing games with logic and people should be looking at why you are doing this.

Is this game going to be defined by constant, incessant bickering? We might have to start killing people just to get some peace and quiet in here!

Please tell me how I'm backing off now? I've said all along the entire time that what led me to being suspicious of you and Mr.W and Ntndeacon was based on the following posts. For crying out loud I have my vote on ntndeacon who wasn't even involved in the discussion about whether or not you knew who scoobz was before hand.

Your comment that I have been trying to run things all game is insulting and untrue. I've done nothing but try to get others to give their reasons for things and to try to get others to drive stuff and not just hop on my feelings alone. I don't mind if you disagree with me or suspect me, but don't be insulting.

Interesting... I didn't play in that game, what was the mechanic?

I was tying him into past games where there was the "sorceror" role (on the side of the bad guys but functioned like a good guy) or a "designated conversion target" role.

That was pretty much my view as well.

Not to be confused with your insistance on treating it like the bad guys MUST HAVE KNOWN he was bad, when in fact it hasn't been proved one way or the other.

I thought that a mechanic where they would have known was unlikely, but I didn't realize that such had been used before.

No one will probably believe me, but with it being a LotR WW, I figured what the heck, I'll come in not throw around accusations and enjoy it a bit. =\