I think some of these have been mentioned, but I think most of these would have been excellent selections.

classic: The Police, Every Breath You Take
epic: Grateful Dead (w/ Donna Godchaux), Terrapin Station
arena: Iron Maiden, 2 Minutes to Midnight
trendsetter: Cherry Poppin' Daddies, Zoot Suit Riot
love song: The Cure, Just Like Heaven
one hit wonder: Love Will Tear Us Apart, Joy Division
party: Jump, House of Pain
crossover: Can't Take My Eyes Off of You, Lauryn Hill
cover: Voodoo Chile, Stevie Ray Vaughn
anti-establishment: Ohio, CSNY

So I'm thinking for the vote we'd ask for first/second/third and do a 5/3/1 points format. Might be better than a simple poll. Does that work for everyone?

Agreed I thought Friends in Low places could have done well as crossover or trendstter for starting the whole 90s pop/country fad

If you do a follow up of worst in music history
This is the clear cut 1.1 pick

If we did a "worst ever" draft, that song would need to be ruled ineligible like Wayne Gretzky in a mid-80s hockey pool.

Putting aside that this song sucks...

This would be a good example of a "great" cover song (assuming you like it, which many people do). For a lot of people it's the definitive version, better than the original. But most people know it's a cover, and they could tell you who did the original. Part of the song's appeal is that it takes a good song and reworks it in such a unique way. Hurt, Heaven's Door and Proud Mary are like that too.

(Tangent: I'd argue that "Hurt" is actually the greatest cover achievement of all time. The original was Reznor's most personally meaningful work, one he'd called the most difficult song he'd ever performed. It was his signature, and most people would have considered it impossible to cover. Then Cash took it even further, to the point where Reznor had to acknowledge that the song wasn't even his anymore.)

As opposed to something like I Love Rock n Roll where most people have no idea that it's a cover, and knowing that it is has no impact at all on most people's thoughts about the song.

I still think its strange that two greatest covers of all-time (Hurt and All Along the Watchtower) weren't used in the competition. Maybe people figure its too easy to find covers...

I was debating between this and chosing either Boston (More Than a Feeling) or Tears For Fears (Rule the World) but I thought I needed something with more epicness and less classicness. I needed to have been more consistent in the draft.

Not using "Hurt" was just a screwup by me. I thought Cash would make a better crossover and I could find a better cover later. In hindsight it was the wrong move, easily.

ahem, Voodoo Chile (Slight Return)

Tainted Love is definitely a cover, I think it is even more brilliant in that the cover is not the main part of the song, but a portion of the song.

No, people just ate them up early in worse categories. :)

As much as I dislike Celine Dion, she is a perfect selection for the Crossover category.

Huh? Coming over the border from Canaday doesn't count as a crossover. How in the world is she crossover?

I had Hurt down as my cover song for a while, then someone frickin' used him up early.

I would've actually used "Iron Man" by The Cardigans as my cover if I believed that anyone else here has actually heard that version. It's everything a cover should be... a good song by itself, and a complete reworking of the original.

How did no one pick "Brickhouse" by the Commodores as a Party Song?

Because "Fight For Your Right" kills it? :)

I did want to say thanks to Maple Leafs for keeping up with all my PM's and using them properly. I wish I could've been around more to participate in the discussion a bit better. It was a good idea and I am looking forward to my 7th place finish! :)

Only in your warped little mind.

;)
:D

Agreed. Maple Leafs did an excellent job. We got through 100 picks in less than a week and managed to not have anyone give away ideas and handled absent drafters without issue. Good work ML!

I really had fun with this. Thanks to Maple Leafs for the idea and execution...

Good stuff.

Wow I posted in this thread more then some of the competitors

She made it big on the french music charts before she even spoke english...I'd say crossing a language barrier would qualify somebody as a crossover artist...no?

oo baby when you talk like that you make a woman go mad

I guess I would not consider French a separate musical genre.

ML, thanks for running this. I thing the "crossover" catergory was the most diffucult and where people stretched. Walk this way is without a doubt the most fitting. I toyed with takin Over and Over again by Nelly and Tim McGraw because it seemed to fit the description of what the catergory should be.

Boy do I hate that song. A couple of years ago when it came out, it was on the radio ALL THE TIME. And that coincided with my going to a gym, where they only played the radio. So in an hour to and hour-and-a-half, I'd hear that song at least twice... all I could hear of the song was "Over and over again"... over and over again. It got past annoying.

A pick like that would result in an automatic disqualification for your team with me. :mad:

Artists that didn't get drafted that I'm somewhat surprised about:

- Pearl Jam
- Simon and Garfunkel
- Bon Jovi
- REM
- Little Richard
- The Police

- Many, many good artists from the 50s and 60s (may have reflected a fear of voter bias)

So ML - when is the vote going to happen?

This is definitely shown in the scores above where Sam Cooke is given a few points lower than the other "Classics".

I should've taken The Police as my Trendsetter... but considered it too late. Also, I was very close to taking Otis Redding as my classic.

And just to show off, here's an empty cupboard team that consists of (I believe) artists/songs that not only weren't drafted, but weren't pick or mentioned after the draft:

Classic: I Heard It Through the Grapevine, Marvin Gaye
Later covered by the California Raisins.

Epic: Sadeness Parts 1, 2 and 3, Enigma -
Really long? Check. Over-produced? Check. Innovative? Check. Chick faking an orgasm throughout it? Check!

Arena: Born to Be Wild, Steppenwolf
Or failing that, Takin' Care of Business by BTO, or Legs by ZZ Top.

Trendsetter: Rock the Boat, Hues Corporation
We didn't say it had to be a good trend.

Love song: Every Rose Has it's Thorns, Poison
You know you think it's awesome.

One hit wonder: Groove is In the Heart, Deelight
This is one of the great under-rated songs of the 90s.

Party: Love Shack, B-52s
Great pick in this category.

Crossover: Give It Away, Red Hot Chili Peppers
OK, it's a stretch. Look, this category sucks, alright?

Cover: Always On My Mind, The Pet Shop Boys
Not a bad one.

Anti-establishment: Bush Killa, Paris
A song about killing George Bush for the Irag war, which includes the excellent line "All I want to see is mother fucking brains hanging", it gets bonus points because it came out in 1991. Talk about being ahead of the curve.

Once I have time to compile a list of all ten rosters. Which could take a while, unless anyone else wants to volunteer ...

I really wanted to go with a Buddy Holly song, but I did not think it would resonate with the voters.


Will this help? http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?k...IZ_tG0Np9qK7QQ

Stairway to Heaven (which I gave the ten) is only 6 years newer than Change is Gonna Come. Change is Gonna Come doesn't hold up as well as Stairway, but it's not because of age in my mind. it's because it's not as much of a classic. I gave Like a Rolling Stone a 9 (1965 release also)....

Must have been a Texas Rangers fan at the time... :)

The biggest surprise missing from the list that I saw - and I think it was entirely because 1/2 of the artist was used on another pick - was Bring Da Noise by Anthrax/Pubic Enema as a Crossover song. I had that as 1B behinf Walk This Way, and only because I think Walk This Way was better known. But the whole rap/metal thing that spawned the collaborations of the early 90s, Korn, RATM, and the entire nu metal sub-genre, started with that song.

fwiw, Change is Gonna Come was in the top 10 of the Rolling Stones top 500 Songs of all time...

Couldn't have been picked because PE had already gone. Same reason Aerosmith couldn't be picked after Walk This Way.

Would have been a great choice, though.

Top 12....

Like a Rolling Stone is #1, btw. But Stairway to Heaven is 31....

Sinatra/Louis Armstrong don't appear in the top 200...so I guess the list is only Rock. I can find places where I would take issues with the list, I'm sure you could do the same. This is not to say the list is "wrong" but just that it represents the opinions of Rock artists and journalists, and it probably, who probably don't exactly represent my personal taste spectrum.

It's not only rock, because "Change is Gonna Come" is not rock.

if it's supposed to be inclusive of all music released in the last 50 yrs and Frank Sinatra doesn't have a song in the top 100, I take issue with it as a list...

Agreed, it's not perfect, i'm just sayin...

What's that one 17-minute song with a crazy long solo in the middle? Ina-goda-navida? Something like that? Help me please. :) The Simpsons referenced it once... Bart replaced their church's organ music with it, and the organ lady was so tired after it.

Now that's an Epic.

I actually considered choosing "In the Garden of Eden" by The Simpsons' Cast as my cover song.

Yep, that song was on my list for epic from the start.

The reason I didn't volunteer for this is because I would have pretty much been irrelevant to the game. I would have had way too many obscure picks that I know wouldn't have been popular, but I would have forced myself to choose anyway. Old habits die hard.

Yeah. My choices didn't go by my tastes at all. If I wasn't so competitive I would've stuck to my guns. ;) But I think if I did that I should've left the spot for someone willing to be competitive since there was a 10 spot limit.

The five artists that I wanted to include but coulldn't find a place for were: Sinatra, Boston, Tears for Fears, Steppenwolf and Red Hot Chili Peppers, as well as U2 in round 5.

I was surprised to see no mention of Pats Cline, given the female requirement. She coulda fit in a bunch of places too, "I fall to pieces" was a huge crossover hit, and "Crazy" coulda been shoehorned into 'cover', 'trendsetter', or 'classic'. I also expected "I fought the law" to get picked early for 'anti-establishment'.

I thought about Patsy Cline. with Crazy

I thought about Patsy Cline as well, but didn't think it would resonate well enough.

Another one that it occurs to me that we missed: Elvis Costello. "Radio Radio" would have been a good Anti-Establishment song.

It's one thing for an artist to do his own thing his own way but it's an entirely different matter to blindside the establishment with a big FU in a not-so-polite way.

I figured I'd post this here rather than the voting thread to avoid influencing anyone:

- Right now I have Subby and Lordscarlet pulling away from the field, with Subby in the lead

- Subby has an amazing number of second place votes - ten total. But he has only two first place votes. Eight of us have at least that many firsts. I have no idea what that means.

- Oilers, Bucc and ntndeacon are all tied for the lead in first place votes (with four) but aren't really in contention right now. Lordscarlet also has four firsts.

The Freebird/Stairway to Heaven combo is the Music Draft equivalent of having Gehrig and Ruth back to back :)

Except, of course, that neither of them is really that great of a song.

Yeah, I said it. :)

OH NO YOU DI'INT!!!!11 :eek:

Exactly, and that's why it's so brilliaint.

I wanna bite the hand that feeds me
I wanna bite that hand so badly
I wanna make them wish they'd never seen me

man, now im going to have to go listen to Armed Forces like 100 times in a row.

Damn you guys!

Where's the voting thread?

http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/....php?p=1404922

In what seems to be an almost daily torture I woke up thinking of another Misfit Toy candidate...

Antiestablishment : School's Out, Alice Cooper

Just for fun...

A clip of a first round draft pick song being performed live by the remaining memebers of the original band, plus another first round band, plus one of the "classic" artist picks.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ahn3-0mYBuc

I was just thinking that a good Love Song would have been "99 Problems" :)

Ice-T or Jay-Z?

Jay-Z

a real good love song woulda been I'll Make Love to You by Boyz II Men

Congratulations to lordscarlet, the winner of the 2007 FOFC Music Draft!



Congratulations to Subby as well on his second place finish



And vtbub narrowly edged out Lathum and NoMyths for 10th place.

Nice work to ML and to all. I would love to do something similar but with TV shows.

I think that would be excellent. :)

I think it is fitting that 3rd place wasn't even mentioned since I couldn't even pick one :)

A couple more "that would have been a good pick" moments on the iPod today...

Anti-Establishment: "Common People" by Pulp
Crossover: "A Little Less Conversation", Elvis vs JXL (although it would have taken Presley off the board)

Woot! Last :)

Umm ... hasn't that been done already?
(I'm pretty sure it has, since I remember taking part in it)

I remember that too, Jon, but damned if I can find it... even in the archives.

Nice work ML - fun to be a part of this.

Here:
http://www.operationsports.com/fofc/...ad.php?t=46578

But the format could be certainly be tweaked and improved.

Well, at least I know I didn't dream the TV version.

Although I don't think it would be my thing, if somebody wanted to do another one of these, seems like a movie theme would be an obvious choice.

And in case Subby is wondering, Pink Flamingos wouldn't be a good choice for Romantic Film. :D

I've been trying to come up with a decent move draft, using either the movies themselves or some sort character/moment theme like we did in the TV draft. It's tougher than you think, for a few of reasons:

- There are so many movies that are remade.
- There are so many movies that are part of a franchise or are sequels
- There are so many unique movies based on common stories or scenarios (meaning drafting characters is pretty much out)

I'm sure there's a way to do it and make it work, but it would be easy to screw up too.

Freebird is a great song. Until you get to the guitar solo, which is the stupidest thing ever.

Just realized that Boston More then a feeling wasn't used after hearing it in the car. That would be a good classic or you could put it in Epic

Heh - I think the jam is what makes the song. :)

Lemme just throw something to the wall here for a minute, see how much of it sticks.

Best war movie (with combat as central to the plot, not just "war era"),
Best date movie (that could appeal to both parties)
Best chick flick (generally women love it, men would rather be shot)
Best cop movie
Best slapstick/stupid comedy (covers both the Three Stooges & most of Will Ferrell's movies)
Best intelligent comedy
Best teen movie (with teens/young adults as central characters, not 'movie teens like the most')
Best Epic
Best Drama

Other possibilities:
Best franchise (would not eliminate individual installments from consideration for other slots), best sequel or prequel best remake (with obvious direct connection to original, not just same theme/plot), Best body of work by a director (would not eliminate directors individual films from play)

Also consider:
Best dialogue, Best special effects, Best Visuals (basically the movie could have sucked but it looked great doing so)

- There are so many movies that are remade.
- There are so many movies that are part of a franchise or are sequels
- There are so many unique movies based on common stories or scenarios (meaning drafting characters is pretty much out)

What would you use as disqualifiers? (As we have used Artist and Song here) Possibly director? Actor? "Title" (Ocean's 11, Dukes of Hazzard, Terminator 2, etc)?

Year of release?

I think the rule you used this time with once the singer is used up would be neat with regard to sequels/remakes....draft one version and you lock up the series.

One thing I thought might have worked well with music (and it might be worth a shot with Movies as well) is to draft the performer and then have access to his "work". So if I draft Eddie Murphy, I can use 48 Hours as my "comedy" and Dream Girls as my "musical".

Then you could have a second phase of draft, the lineup reveal. At this point, you have a second draft where the rule about using a movie twice comes into play. So if I want 48 hours as one my comedies, I have to make sure I name it before the Nick Nolte owner does. I think drafting a roster of performers only works if you have a very deep number of positions to fill, so maybe you have 5 comedies or something. It's possible the reveal phase could be conducted via priority list so the whole thing doesn't take too long.

Another possibility for the reveal phase would be to do something along the lines of an American Idol contest. For instance, if you have ten contestants, you come up with ten different "themes", but you don't tell anybody what order the themes will be played. Theme 1 gets randomly selected and everybody names their 3 best in the theme. Then the populus votes and whomever is the worst in a category is "voted off" that week, and you move on to the next theme. This would lead to a teams having to strive to pick balanced/versatile performers to meet all the themes adequately or suffer the consequences.

These may be too complex/time consuming, but I think they have some potential.

Again, just WAG'ing this idea a bit, I'm not sure how many would have to be disqualified/how desirable strict disqualification is in this niche. Being fairly wide open might lend it's own set of controversies/difficult decisions for voters who think someone chose, for example, the wrong Eastwood movie (that reminds me, Best Western should get a category, so should Best Sci-Fi & Best Horror) in their draft pick.

Still, maybe something like "movie with same artist with a significant role cannot be taken in the same category"; i.e. choosing an Eastwood film as Best Western would eliminate his other westerns but you could still select one of the Dirty Harry movies as Best Cop Movie or something with him as Philo Beddoe for Best Date Movie ;)

Another thing you could do is use imdb as a resource. Say something like, if an actor is listed as one of the first 6 cast members any other film where he is listed in the first 6 cast members is now unavailable.

So looking for example at Oceans 12

http://imdb.com/title/tt0349903/

This would eliminate Pitt, Zeta-Jones, Clooney, Kross, Roberts, and Tiffany but people could still pick Crash since Don Cheadle wasn't listed in the top 6 for Ocean's 12

I didnt' remember we had done a TV draft but I think a Movies draft would be a great idea...provided we could come up with a set of rules that wouldn't eliminate half of the movies simply by picking Speilberg and Lucas as 1.1 and 1.2.

I also haven't figured out how the disqualifiers would work...but it occurred to me that a movie version could just follow the basic categories of the original game:

- Classic
- Epic
- Arena Rocker (not sure what the translation would be)
- Trendsetter...due to the way it's directed/produced, or just due to being the one that started a genre
- Love (Movie)
- One-Hit Wonder...either director or actor who had one major hit, never to be heard from again (to an extent)
- Party (Movie)
- Crossover...performance, as an actor/director breaks free from his usual genre
- Cover...ie remake.
- Anti-Establishment (not really sure about this one either)

actually we did a movie version as well.

dola
well actor version...
categories were like
director, comic actor, romntics lead, etc.

Since this is a sports board, you guys should do a sports themed draft.

Best [insert sport] Team
Best Game
Best male athelte
Best female athlete
Best single game performance
etc...

Schmidty did an athelete's draft last year. Most of the main subjects have been covered, but there's always a new spin you can put on them. I'm kicking around a sports-related idea for down the road.

If anyone is going to enjoy this.. it's you guys:

Unreleased Jimmy Page Guitar Riff To Be Retrieved from Secret Vault To Save Rock and Roll

http://www.theonion.com/content/news...ge_guitar_riff