You told me something too last night. My talking about you I feared would make it too obvious what the other person's role is on an accident I made earlier in an assumption. I figured I wouldn't call on you to vouch for me since I didn't want to out the other person. I honestly am a common londoner, so losing me to catch someone else in a lie is not a bad gamble. I would make that gamble with someone else in any game when its a person claiming a normal role vs someone claiming a special role, so it would be hypocritical of me to think otherwise here. Im normal, so losing me doesn't lose a special role.

I honestly don't mind dying, I just dont want it to be a run away. I want people to put their stake on who they believe so something can be learned from my death. I do mind dying in a senseless runaway death that doesnt help us. I feel if the vote is close, it helps us alot more than otherwise.

Barkeep, can you tell us what you learned about each of your clients so far? I think I know the info on three of them from earlier in the thread, but would like a recap all in one post if you don't mind putting it out there.

Trying to read through the thread to catch up but this caught my eye.

Also, there's a reason why I didn't defend myself today. I told y'all that I'd be out until about 7 EST at work.

Alan, can you give me a rundown of your finances, from start to now?

Start with x
Pay urchin, down to y
Visit den, down to z
Robbed, down to 0
Recover some money, up to #

Etc, etc.

I voted for LSG before I left this morning. :)

I technically didn't hit 0 when I was robbed. I never said I lost all of my money there.

Night 0 I did nothing so had 10 shillings
Day 1 got 3 more shillings at the end of the day I think? I actually asked CR clarification on when the payday happened every day and if he had any rough guideline on how much is normal spending for an urchin so I had an idea what to spend (I wasn't clear that we were competing against so many others at the time like I am now).

CR said he couldnt answer the second question but the first question I get paid at the end of the day so I assume that means lynch time.

So.. day 1 at lynch I had 13 shillings then. I offered some for an urchin and used 5 for the opium den night 1.

I came back and found I was robbed and ended night 1 with 5 shillings.

End of day 2 I got 3 more which would be 8 shillings, but I spent 5 more last night as you now know on the worst lover I've had since my ex-wife.

My PM from last night said I have 3 shillings and would have 6 tonight.

Well I'll give you 3 of 4 visits:

Path -- Learned where he lives. I see no reason to make that info public at this time, especially as path has indicated he doesn't want it out there.

Bullet -- He is as common as I am pretty

Alan -- Learned about this rounders thing.

It seems as though I don't learn what info I give up, which is frustrating. So I've told alan something, but I'm not sure what I've told him. I think my other johns have revealed what I told them.

I'm willing to move off of Alan, but not onto Blade.

Okay. All caught up. I can tell you that voting for Blade is probably a mistake. I can tell you that voting for me is definitely a mistake. I have increased my circle of trust to:

Barkeep
hoops
Blade
path
bulletsponge
Mr. Wednesday
st. cronin
Daddy Torgo
dubb
Schmidty
saldana
DC
Izulde

That leaves LSG, Alan T, and Swaggs. I am reasonably sure (if the extended trust list is right) that at least two of them are evil. There may be someone on the trust list that is evil, but I don't know. I'm good for voting for any of the three of them. Since LSG isn't getting any votes, I'll

UNVOTE LSG
VOTE ALAN T.

Alan, do you feel that you can say whose role you were worried about blowing, since it's obviously not your own or Barkeep's?

Raiders, do you understand why i said what i said? Im hoping we understand each other

Well if I tell you, then it will out someone else's role.. I partially expect they know I know so will leave it up to them if they want me to out it. To help you out barkeep, I find it likely that you know this person's role obviously in order to tell me. So I dont know how many roles you -know- but maybe that helps narrow it down for you some.

Roger

RA, I think it would be a mistake to assume that the supposed commonpeople are all what they seem.

Hoops if you're going after all this information I think it's time you come clean yourself.

I gotta play Marvel Ultimate Alliance with my son. I'll be back in a bit.

Dola, so if you are saying that you trust them, should I infer that you know something that I don't?

I honestly thought they had previously revealed it before I kinda goofed today. It might have been subtle enough that others didnt notice.. Im not sure. I guess I wasn't suprised to find it out so something in my head thought it was already out.

I will say I don't understand why they are keeping it a secret, but its their role and while losing me isnt a huge deal, losing them Im not sure if its as good.

Barkeep, hoops isn't on the block and Alan is.

is this to me or someone else?

Alan, I'm not asking you to reveal what the role is, or even any circumstances around your learning it. All I'm asking is if you can indicate which player it is?

e.g. "I think it's Mr. Wednesday's role that I would be revealing."
or, "No, I think even saying who it is would be too much information."

Weird. I only know bullet's role. I just went and reread all of them. So unless it's bullets role (which I've already publicly stated) then somehow I told you something that I am not myself aware of as a player.

Day 1 at lynch you had 13 shillings - you offered 7 for an urchin based on your earlier post, then 5 for opium den. That should leave you with 1. And if you were robbed there would only be one to take.

What am I missing here?

Its to RA

Mr. W: Using your own argument, RA isnt on the block, Alan is

I hear ya but it wasn't just alan he's been pushing for. I just quoted that.

If it had actually been a dola, rather than two posts slipping in between, it would have been apparent that I was addressing RA. :)

He's got a bunch of people that I've not made out to be anything more than clients of the various working women, either by observation or admission, and I wanted to know if he was merely infering trust from that, or if he had additional information.

BK, can you reveal what type of information you learned about the other john? Don't name him, but indicate something like:
- learned where he lived
- learned a role
- learned that he is a sexual deviant

Whatever broad category of knowledge you learned, if you don't feel this is too damning.

If I say who it is, the role will be obvious. I've been pretty transparent about my beliefs of everyone this game. So wasn't holding it back.

Blade is right, I did make a mistake today, but saying I tried to get an orphan day 1 wasn't it. I'll respect the other person and expect they know who Im talking about. If they dont want it out, I'll go to my death with it held in. I honestly don't know why they are hiding it, but so be it.

Hmm. This is a money thing seems to be fairly damning since I know he had 5 shillings for me last night. The whole accounting thing doesn't seem to add up. I'm buying it, though I am still pissy towards Blade.

Vote Alan T

And someone else notices his numbers dont work...

Is this in reference to my pressing Alan for a name, or RA for whether he has additional information that would clear the folks that seem to be commoners?

I learned what he saw that night and something else which might be significant, or might not be. I'm hoping I run into him again and get further refinement.

My understanding are the bribes aren't done in person. I have no idea who I was trying to bribe or if its even an ordinary player or a NPC. From what I understand, you leave it for them and come back later to see if it was taken or not.

BK, if you really think there is value in me "coming clean" I will. I have felt that there was greater value in me retaining some level of mystery about what my role may be.

I'm pretty sure you already know what my role is, so I'm a little surprised you are asking for this, though ...

RA

Dola -- What he saw was Izulde's getting arrested, suggesting that happened during the first half of the night.

Its not bullet.. and it says very clearly you tell me player X is a Y

So if you have a lower bid, you don't end up losing the money? This should be pretty easy to verify from others who have pursued the urchins ...

I do know what your role is, you're right. I suppose that's what I could have passed on to Alan T. I don't think you gain the advantage you think you do, but I will defer to your judgement. It would just be a shame for you to die anyway with so much knowledge.

My PM states quite clearly to do the action i will stop and orphan and bribe him(clearly implies in person). At the end of the night, i will either get my money back at my place of residence or a note.

But my PM at least seems very clear i offer it in person.

Yeah I realized I'm a dolt when talking with hoops.

I saw the arrest early, then saw the event in Bishopsgate later.

it is clear to me that the bribe is done in person as well...i did get my money back the day i lost the bid though...alan saying he didnt do his in person makes me feel alot better about my vote

thats 2 mistakes.

Alan, here's the math problem.

You start with 13 shillings.
Offer 7 as a bribe, spend 5 on the den, leaving one.
Then you get robbed.
And your offer was not accepted.
Conceivable results:
one -- the seven was stolen.
seven -- the one was stolen.
eight -- nothing was stolen.
four, ten, or eleven -- above plus the three that you receive as income.
Inconsistent result that you claim:
five -- ???

This could work if you offered less than you claim (why?), or if your account was capped at ten. Are you saying that only some of your money was stolen?

Umm... my PM says something different. I can stop and bribe him, but I don't remember it saying if it was an NPC or not. I do know that if I'm not the winning bidder, I do not lose the money.

Put 2 and 2 together on why he is asking it.

And then try to figure out what my slip up this morning was.

Ugh.. I give up.

Well, Im going to take it easy for a while. The masses have spoken.

I dunno if i will be back before lynch or not, but if not, my final parting shot:

I have tried to be honest about as much as I could this game. I am good, my name is Charles Shanding and I am the town cooper.

I have actually messed up a few times this game.. but at this point its irrelevant. I've just played a bad game I think all together.

I messed up my notes on what I did day 1, and didnt realize it till I got to the hotel. I originally told Chief to put 4 shillings down, but then realized I would get 3 more at the time and wrote down 4+3 on my notes for 7. My pm to chief only asked for 6. At this point I dont honestly care if anyone believes me however I do want people to know Blade might be telling the truth when I die tonight about what he put in. I made the mistake not him.

My next mistake was that my notes I had down hoops as a prosititute and when I found out the info from barkeep last night it didnt suprise me since i had figured that out based on stuff in the thread. I said as much this morning when he responded that he never outed himself, so I quickly changed my direction trying to cover for it.

That made my talking about barkeep tonight a pain because I would have to out hoops if pressed or just take it with me to my grave.

Other than that, I honestly know zilch. I havent seen anyone, talked to anyone, been visited by anyone or anything. I've tried to make all of my judgements on people's actions in the thread which is a pain since people are vouching for the 3 or 4 people who havent done sqwat or said anything and wont even say why... All it leaves the rest of us with is trying to track down if this group are the good guys or the bad guys and nothing to base it on.

It might be great for everyone else to play super-sleuth and hide it all, but for me it made it difficult. the people i suspected in raiders, schmidty, swaggs, etc was solely because I couldn't get a read on any of them because they didnt hardly even participate any.

Sorry I can't leave with any super great insight or anything, but I've pretty much played my worst game since perhaps the harry potter game. I just was awful. I probably shouldn't sign up for games on weeks when I have so much work to do and travel but so be it.

Anyways I'm flying out tommorrow and will be gone anyways, so this is as good as any day for me to die. I wish my death told you more, but guess its not to be. I had fun, and thanks to Chief for a good game.

Dola, actually, four, ten, or eleven don't make sense, scratch those. It should be one, seven, or eight, but not five.

OK, for the 50% of the people who have not seen me out shaking my ass at night I'm the last prostitute.

Night 0 - in Commercial I saw BK, SnDvls, and hooked up with Tyrith who lived in Commercial

Night 1 - no hookups, but saw the people enter and leave Cavell (NTN, Cronin, Blade, and Lathum)

Night 2 - hookup with Path, learned he was in opium den on Night 1. Saw BK score twice. Saw Blade, Cronin, and Schmidty all in Bishopsgate during 2nd phase, and witnessed some interation involving Schmidty that I have not completely explained yet but asked for the parties directly involved to comment upon

OK... I already knew about hoops. I think half the people playing already knew about hoops. :)

We've still got a monetary inconsistency, though, even with an offer of six instead of seven.

Sorry guys, I messed up on my original bribe, but it very clearly says I return home and find my bribe untaken. It also says I am left with only 5 shillings. No idea why the math works the way it does, but oh well.

Anyways, best of luck to all, going to do other stuff :)

hoops, I've said more than once that I don't think it's possible for the parties involved to comment upon it without a full role reveal, which is in nobody's interest unless they're on the block.

P.S. before I go, I don't like taking shots at people, but Blade, its a little tiring always being your target. I honestly don't know if you are good or bad but I'll enjoy watching your remarks when I turn up good either way.

If you want to know why the shilling discrepency, ask Chief. I have no clue.

We can talk about it after the game, but to be honest you were my most trusted person in the game until about mid-day today when cronin said bad guys might be able to bribe and what not. Then you worried me, and then you said 7. But until then, you were my most trusted ally.

Anyone have a vote count?

MrW, I'll drop it if you guys are confident we have a bad guy. When I was asking the questions we (the collective group on Alan) didn't sound terribly confident on our vote beyond Blade, who was the one calling out Alan.

If Alan shows up good I'm going to want to understand that meeting in a lot more detail than I do right now. If Alan shows up as a bad guy I won't mention it again (for awhile, anyways :) ) and will modify my trust lists accordingly.

7 on alan i think, 3 on me...i think, not sure if barkeep voted, but either way alan is getting lynched.

unvote raiders army

vote blade

I really think Alant is good
And since there is only one more person on the chooping block i had to go with him to keep things tight

Alan just said he actually submitted a bid of 6, not 7, and it was his mistake, not mine. So when he turns up good, dont blame me for trying to catch a bad guy.

Ill discuss this after the game hoops, but your really annoying me right now. For all the times you say i dont listen to reason, your making up for it with this constant pushing when multiple people have said stop.

Yes you should infer something. :)

Basically, here is my list:

I'm fairly sure that the following aren't evil:

Barkeep
st. cronin
hoops
Blade
path
Mr. Wednesday
DC
Izulde

barkeep trusts for bulletsponge
You (Mr. Wednesday) trusts for Daddy Torgo, bulletsponge, and dubb
st. cronin trusts hoops, barkeep, blade, Schmidty, and saldana

That leaves Alan T, LSG, and Swaggs if my process of elimination is correct.

So I'll ask again, did anyone hire an urchin last night? It seems improbable that NO ONE hired one... I would assume these type of services would be immensely popular.

Dodgerchick too

Of the people who bid on day 1, i didnt place a bid, saldana didnt place one, alan didnt place one, and i dont know who else. I think last night really might have gone with no one. Though a few people like schmidty havent said much, so maybe he did.

If Alan T turns out to be who I thinks he is, then I'm fairly sure that you will be who I think you are. How's that for being vague?

She's in there.

Are you sure you trust her? I dont trust her, but if you are sure...

LSG and AlanT are who we thought they were!!!



Sorry, Denny Green flashback ;)

Blade I still want a response:

How do you justify attempting to have me lynched with what you knew to be a lie?

I didnt lie about my urchin's views, at least not that time

BTW, Schmidty mentioned he had financial problems and might get his internet turned off... did we get a replacement for him?

Blade, I think this would be an excellent topic for discussion after the game is over. Because it has bugged the heck out of me today.

dola,

Hope all turns out okay Schmidty; it's really, really tough being in that kind of situation... lord knows we've had our share of financial issues.

You'll be in my thoughts.

I'm fairly sure since she was the first to vouch for Izulde. I believe somewhere today someone else vouched for her as well. Of course my list is entirely predicated on some things better left unsaid at this point.

Wait. Did you or did you not see Raiders and I there?

Without a doubt, I trust hoops, st. cronin, barkeep, path, and blade.

I mean we all know your urchin gave you bad info at this point since I think there's little disputing that bullet was also in the district, at the bare minimum, since we slept together. Just trying to figure out how bad your info was.

Boy am I curious to see how this lynch turns out.

Id perfer not to answer this right now

So let's just be clear: You would prefer not to answer whether or not you lied in the process of attempting to get a good guy lynched?

Well, I guess I need to vote, I don't wanna miss too much of the Ravens vs. Bengals game.

Vote AlanT

Everything he said I agreed with up until the accounting discrepancy. Alan is known for his detail and I cannot fathom him making a mistake like that. When I found out how much money I made a day, I was already thinking of scenarios on how to spend it, including hiring an urchin (I felt some comfort knowing that if I bid, my money would not be lost).

dola,

It's driving me nuts that a lot of people aren't willing to share information... it really, really bugs me.

Including AlanT, he knows something on someone, but is not willing to out them. It bothers me that he's willing to die with this info which is not good for the village.

Well, the information that has been shared has tended to just totally baffle me.

I did not lie in attempting to get you lynched, does that make your hissy fit better?

Well, if I were in his position right now I'd spill the beans...but then again I'm a good guy. ;) A bad guy would just fake it.

Alan has spilled "it" - he says he learned that I was a prostitute.

I understand. I sit here holding back info only
1. If I don't feel like it's my secret to divulge (like I did with hoop's role as a prostitute)
or
2. The information seems like it makes more sense to try and gather more of it and paint a more complete picture.

Your not one though, are you?...i had you pegged in a similar, but not exactly the same role.

Yes, though I'm clearly missing something important about the information you have.

No shit, that was the big secret? I was in suspense the whole time, I thought it was something juicy.

I know. That's why I didn't quite get the way hoops was playing.

Ohhhhhhhh...the opening is there....

go for it!

Yeah, well the real juicy part is something that the prostitute's clients don't wanna know!!!

I am - I tried to keep some level of suspense so people might think I'm the Bordello Mom or some unlisted role, but I'm just another streetwalker.

Throughout the game I've tried to give as much of my info as possible without explicitly listing my role, figuring if a bad guy or two took me for a more important role they might gun for me instead of taking out one of the more meaningful roles.

Well it worked since Lathum was gunning for you on Night 1.

Reading over the thread again, I feel quite good about this lynch. Alan is lying about more than one thing, and never did reveal anything useful.

Woah, how do we know that?

I thought you were the bordello mom too, so you fooled me

RA, does that mean that Lathum was not one of the people completing a kill on Night 1? Because that would imply that we are likely still facing three bad guys ...

Out for the night.

Good luck, London.

And the whole rounders thing is just plain strange. Could just be CR's idea of a joke, which is what I think it is, as I'm at a loss to understand how it relates to the game in any fashion.